Microsoft is reportedly in talks to buy TikTok's US operations • Hacker News Board

Re: Microsoft is reportedly in talks to buy TikTok's US operations

#471

Post by mvc » Sat, Aug 01, 2020, 9:07 AM UTC

jjcon wrote: post #363

billfruit wrote: post #360

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even sale to Microsoft would looks legally dubious I think, if federal government is seen to be involved in brokering such a deal or ordering Microsoft to do it. I don't think the federal government or at least the executive should have that kind of authority like asking/forcing Microsoft to do a specific thing. I don't know about China, but US executive and legislative have limits to their authority and I doubt such…

> I don't think the federal government or at least the executive should have that kind of authority like asking/forcing Microsoft to do a specific thing. No you misunderstand - Read the article, TikTok would sell off to keep operating in the US (just like Amazon had to sell off data centers to operate them in the EU). The US government wouldn’t be forcing Microsoft, just saying if you want to operate with American da…

> just like Amazon had to sell off data centers to operate them in the EU

You're saying amazon don't own their EU data centers? That's surprising to me. Got a source for that?

Re: Microsoft is reportedly in talks to buy TikTok's US operations

#472

Post by zeroer » Sat, Aug 01, 2020, 9:18 AM UTC

xnx wrote: post #376

It appears as though very few Hacker News commenters have spent any time using Tiktok. It is the only enjoyable, enriching social media service I've ever used. Most everything many of us liked about the old/weird internet is present on Tiktok right now: almost no ads or commercial presense, personal content from real people (not hyper produced productions from influencers and pros), weird content, niche content, orga…

On your suggestion I browsed the front page for 10 minutes just to see what all the fuss has been about. Tiktok is worse than I could have imagined.

Re: Microsoft is reportedly in talks to buy TikTok's US operations

#473

Post by rumanator » Sat, Aug 01, 2020, 9:19 AM UTC

jianshen wrote: post #442

xnx wrote: post #376

It appears as though very few Hacker News commenters have spent any time using Tiktok. It is the only enjoyable, enriching social media service I've ever used. Most everything many of us liked about the old/weird internet is present on Tiktok right now: almost no ads or commercial presense, personal content from real people (not hyper produced productions from influencers and pros), weird content, niche content, orga…

My personal opinion is people don't realize the app/algorithm doesn't just reward the viewers, it rewards the creators. I do video/photo work outside of coding and at first what got me hooked was the effortless video tools (useful realtime effects, non-generic music). Not a video editor? Someone in my feed already posted a 15s tutorial so you learn how to create as you consume. Then after posting a few vids as a joke…

> the algorithm rewarded me with 100k's views

Question:

a) why do you interpret that as a reward?

b) what leads you to believe those views are real or even meaningful?

Re: Microsoft is reportedly in talks to buy TikTok's US operations

#474

Post by pmachinery » Sat, Aug 01, 2020, 9:20 AM UTC

pmachinery wrote: post #428

onetimemanytime wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're called Commissars https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commissar imagine one standing over as you code and reminding yo what the Party expects...and if x feature is complaint with Party ideals or not.

That link makes absolutely no reference to China in any way.

It's pretty sad when human beings are reduced to the level of downvoting objective facts.

Re: Microsoft is reportedly in talks to buy TikTok's US operations

#475

Post by mantap » Sat, Aug 01, 2020, 9:21 AM UTC

pmachinery wrote: post #459

mantap wrote: post #436

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't really blame people for considering that. We know that China does participate in online misinformation (as does the UK and Russia to be fair). Additionally, people in China don't have a lot of freedom of speech to criticise the government. So unfortunately it does put a certain gloss on it when someone in mainland China writes something that the Chinese government would approve of. Because of the chilling e…

You aren't getting only one half of the picture, you're getting an additional half. Denouncing people who provide that other half as "suspect" is itself an attempt to ensure only one half of the picture is heard/accepted.

For someone in China to criticise the central government is for them to risk their liberty. It's not a good life to be dissident in China.

Freedom of speech affects freedom of thought. If you can't say something then nobody else will hear it. And if you can't hear a certain viewpoint then you are less likely to consider it.

So you have to imagine the missing comments from China, firstly the person who wanted to criticise the government but was too afraid to say it, and secondly the person who never had a chance to consider criticising the government because they live in a place where that criticism is taboo.

Re: Microsoft is reportedly in talks to buy TikTok's US operations

#476

Post by busymom0 » Sat, Aug 01, 2020, 9:37 AM UTC

glglwty wrote: post #183

ericmay wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, probably because that's not what is happening. The US has the right to ban companies from the country (as do other countries). What the US is saying is that the parent company (Bytedance) bust divest Tik Tok or they'll lose access to the US market. Microsoft is interested in it, but it could be a different company buying it. This is different than "you must sell this company to this other company" because the U…

Is there any precedence where the executive branch just ban a foreign company without citing the violation of law and going through court or WTO, in the last century?

Not fully up to date with what eventually happened but few years ago when Grindr was sold to Chinese company, US tried to get them to sell it back to US ownership because it had a lot of confidential location data of military personnel.

Re: Microsoft is reportedly in talks to buy TikTok's US operations

#477

Post by robbrown451 » Sat, Aug 01, 2020, 9:38 AM UTC

rumanator wrote: post #473

jianshen wrote: post #442

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My personal opinion is people don't realize the app/algorithm doesn't just reward the viewers, it rewards the creators. I do video/photo work outside of coding and at first what got me hooked was the effortless video tools (useful realtime effects, non-generic music). Not a video editor? Someone in my feed already posted a 15s tutorial so you learn how to create as you consume. Then after posting a few vids as a joke…

> the algorithm rewarded me with 100k's views Question: a) why do you interpret that as a reward? b) what leads you to believe those views are real or even meaningful?

These are odd questions to me.

I can understand why someone might not care about having some level of "internet fame." But I can't really understand how someone can not get how that can be rewarding to many.

Do you understand why people are rewarded by an audience applauding them? Do you understand why a musician would be excited to hear their song on the radio?

As for how they know the views are real... do you think TikTok is just faking them?

Re: Microsoft is reportedly in talks to buy TikTok's US operations

#478

Post by rumanator » Sat, Aug 01, 2020, 9:39 AM UTC

johnchristopher wrote: post #470

kenhwang wrote: post #458

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No, that's unfair, you are saying all of tiktok content is low quality noise, which is wrong In the board world of "video content", yes it is. It might be better than FB/Instagram/Twitter videos, but those and Tiktok pale in comparison to, say, HBO. Tiktok is gifs with sound filmed on a cell phone with a refreshing take on recommendations optimized for stickiness. It's the McDonalds of video content; maybe better t…

And HBO (which just repackages books into a format lazy people can digest and turn their brains off to) pales in comparison to the free MITx online video courses. That's pseudo-intellectual arrogance. Even some PhD laugh about stupid memes. Also: facebook/insta/tw is mainly about re sharing, not producing.

> That's pseudo-intellectual arrogance.

You're out of line here. It is what it is, and just pointing out that stuff made with cheap passive fast mass consumption in mind is not arrogance or pseudo-intellectual. Complaining that bubblegum is not nutritional as a good meal at a nice restaurant is not pseudo-intellectual arrogance. You may argue that they have different usecases in mind but that's not an intellectual argument, nor an arrogant statement. Your attempts to resort to name-calling and ad-hominem attacks also don't help your case or even your ability to support your accusation.

Re: Microsoft is reportedly in talks to buy TikTok's US operations

#479

Post by tarkin2 » Sat, Aug 01, 2020, 9:39 AM UTC

xnx wrote: post #376

It appears as though very few Hacker News commenters have spent any time using Tiktok. It is the only enjoyable, enriching social media service I've ever used. Most everything many of us liked about the old/weird internet is present on Tiktok right now: almost no ads or commercial presense, personal content from real people (not hyper produced productions from influencers and pros), weird content, niche content, orga…

Tiktok has beaten the US competition. The soft-power dominance of the US—especially with Zoom—has taken a massive hit lately. China has outperformed the US on the global stage. The fact the US has to ban Tiktok, not outcompete, is surely a worrying sign for the US: it’s now on the soft-power defensive against a cultural and military adversary in one of the US’s strongest areas.

Re: Microsoft is reportedly in talks to buy TikTok's US operations

#480

Post by DiogenesKynikos » Sat, Aug 01, 2020, 9:41 AM UTC

yorwba wrote: post #249

ericmay wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep -> "That order marked the sixth time a U.S. president has either blocked a deal or ordered a corporate selloff since Congress authorized the power to intervene in 1988." WSJ - https://www.wsj.com/articles/trump-to-sign-order-demanding-c... I don't know the details of the others, but one that comes to mind (and maybe is mentioned in the article?) is the blocked acquisition of Qualcomm by Broadcom. -edit- The circu…

> I don't see the WTO being involved when China forces majority-owned joint ventures Did you check? https://www.wto.org/english/tratop_e/dispu_e/cases_e/ds549_e...

WTO accession had massive economic, political and legal implications within China. There's a good review here: [1].

Discussions in the West tend to completely ignore these changes. For example, joint venture requirements have been removed from most sectors of the economy. Or to give another example, an entire legal system to protect and enforce IP has been set up in the last two decades or so, and that system is now very heavily used (including by foreign companies).

1. https://lawdigitalcommons.bc.edu/iclr/vol27/iss2/6/