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Why We Terminated Daily Stormer

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Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer

#471

Post by jquery »

yzmtf2008 wrote: post #429
jquery wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to Blind, at least 40% of Silicon Valley workers support what Trump said regarding this incident. Probably less than 1% support the ideas of Neo-nazis or the Daily Stormer. You're making a false assumption and dehumanizing those who disagree with you.

> According to Blind Do you see the problem with that sampling method? Blind is a pretty self-selecting audience, and I wouldn't say it represents the average tech industry at all.

It's the best data available until people start offering up, in real life, their true opinions on sensitive issues in Silicon Valley, which I'm sure will happen any day now.

Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer

#472

Post by matt4077 »

adventured wrote: post #278
emodendroket wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In fact private corporations already have the right to censor or refuse service to any of their customers.

That is not the primary issue being debated here. The issue is: once all the big platforms are aggressively enforcing speech controls, supported by a wider shift in the culture that backs that, how likely is it that the government will take the opportunity to become a speech regulator as it pertains to the Internet just as they are with broadcast & radio today. I say: it's guaranteed as an inevitable outcome, if the…

Every country in the world has more stringent free speech laws as the US, and the democracies among them have not devolved into dictatorships. So I'd be careful with any certainty approaching a "guarantee of an inevitable outcome:.

Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer

#473

Post by didgeoridoo »

kelnos wrote: post #310
rangibaby wrote: post #221

slippery slope

I really dislike the perfunctory "slippery slope" type argument. It's never an argument not to do something; it's merely a warning to make sure that you don't use an action as a stepping stone to taking more extreme actions. Saying that banning certain things is a slippery slope, and using that excuse to never ban things, means that it's ok to allow truly horrendous things to happen, just because of fear of overreach…

Yelling "fire" in a crowded theater is not in itself illegal. If a panic resulted, you could be held responsible for that panic and any injuries that resulted, but the speech itself is not, as many like to pretend, "an exception to freedom of speech." The Supreme Court corrected itself on this because it feared the very same slippery slope argument you're trying to dismiss.

Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer

#474

Post by syrrim »

ransom1538 wrote: post #468

This is how life is for people in Porn. Let's say you host porn. Let's also assume you wish to charge for porn. Many banks, credit card merchants, etc DO NOT wish to deal with your company at all. They wont take your transfers nor business. There are merchants that are comfortable taking payments from you (CCBill) but they cost much more since they have the expertise to deal with these types of chargebacks etc. I am…

Cloudflare is in the business of protecting websites from DDOS attacks (and various other things). They should of course try to estimate the cost of protecting a given client, and forward that cost onto them. However, if that client is willing to pay, their business centers around protecting them. I highly doubt daily stormer is their worst client in terms of DDOS protection or any other service.

Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer

#475

Post by taneq »

eyelidlessness wrote: post #416
taneq wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That was kind of the point. Non-discrimination, like free speech, is worthless if it only applies to things you approve of.

Nazis are not a protected class.

To be honest, the whole idea of protected vs. non-protected classes makes me uncomfortable. Yes, there are some things that force you to compromise your ideals in order to make a workable system, but it's a hack, not a proper solution.

Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer

#476

Post by ahhhhhhhhhh »

tuna-piano wrote: post #77
r721 wrote: post #4

>“This was my decision. This is not Cloudflare’s general policy now, going forward,” Cloudflare CEO Matthew Prince told Gizmodo. “I think we have to have a conversation over what part of the infrastructure stack is right to police content.” (from internal email) >Let me be clear: this was an arbitrary decision. It was different than what I’d talked talked with our senior team about yesterday. I woke up this morning i…

It's so bizarre. He tries to have it both ways. He says "no one should have that power", but then says he did it literally earlier that day. He says CloudFlare isn't changing their "content-neutral" policy... but clearly they did change that policy. I have many reasons to oppose nazis, including incredibly personal ones. That said, I think crossing this content line for an infrastructure company is a big deal, and I…

no one should have that power, but fuck nazis

Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer

#477

Post by rtpg »

jquery wrote: post #213
rtpg wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Serious question: where's the line? The government shouldn't be censoring. I don't allow white nationalists into my house. At what point does "I" represent something too big for me to no longer have the moral privilege to refuse to collaborate with white nationalists?

Maybe when you get in the business of providing speech as a service. For example, imagine you went into the wedding cake business, and someone came in and wanted you to make a gay wedding cake (note: not a wedding cake for gay people, but a wedding cake that normalized gay marriage). Now imagine you're a very old-school traditionalist about that sort of thing. Should you be compelled to make that cake with two women…

beyond the fact that the wedding cake hasn't been decided, the point of that case isn't about free speech but about protected classes.

You don't want to let (for example) landlords to deny lending to people because they're gay, black, etc. Not as much of a free speech thing as a 14th ammendment thing

Re: Why We Terminated Daily Stormer

#478

Post by ahhhhhhhhhh »

PeanutCurry wrote: post #341

I'm obviously being a bit facetious when I say this, but are there really few things worse than nazis? I'm not expert on the subject of neo-nazis or the nazi movement, so maybe this seems more complex because of my position of ignorance. But none of the statistics seem to imply that nazis are more than simply intellectually repulsive and socially disgusting. That's not to say that nazi affiliated groups never commit…

dude you're being pedantic about how bad nazis are, is this really worth it
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