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Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

anthropic.com

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Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#461
post #35

“ Claude Fable 5.1's writing is generally a step up from earlier Claude models, with fewer stock phrases and less unexplained jargon. In some cases, though, its prose is denser than Claude Fable 5's: sentences run longer and there are fewer paragraph breaks.” I cancelled my pro max Claude subscription last week; codex is much more succinct. I am curious if this is getting better. I don’t think Anthropic realizes that…

Forgive me this long letter, I hadn't the time to make it short. —Pascal

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#462

I suggest you to give a look to the MCP protocol for hardware that is being proposed by Anthropic. The hardware will be the next harness of LLMs, they will be able to operate machines to reinforce their theories. I still think that a major problem is that biological processes are not “fast” as coding, but they are verifiable. If during post processing we are able to give enough harness to test and verify this kind of…

Model Hardware Standard will be awesome. Company I work for still needs humans though, until then: https://xff.cz/

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#463

Anyone ever seen the SouthPark episode making fun of Game of Thrones: A Song of Ass and Fire? Anthropic's announcements reminds me of "The Dragons Are Coming" running joke. What they have done: * Nerfed Fable, as many of noted it's useless * Leverage Mythos as a marketing strategy, claiming its too good to release * Removed thought traces, one of the only useful things to make sure your prompts are working correctly…

Text watermarking has no effect on output quality, it just works by changing the explicit source of randomness that is in practice always present in LLM output sampling. See for example https://www.seangoedecke.com/ai-text-watermarking-is-not-a-b....

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#464

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a pet theory that the Opus prose style/smell we all have grown weary of is due at least in part to the models writing more for themselves and each other than for humans. They're packing lots of signal into fewer words and they don't care if it sounds cringe because it works better as glue in long-running tasks. I'm also thinking of the 2017 novel "Void Star" where AIs who operate everything have long since lef…

It's to increase output tokens. Full stop. You think the developers creating a state-of-the-art AI intelligence can't figure this out?

After a year of not being able to serve Claude because they ran out of datacenters I don't think they want to go back to that.

(If they did, they wouldn't have added the effort level.)

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#465

The price reduction comes from the cache read pricing falling from $1/M to $0.25/M, which means that Fable 5.1 now costs half of Opus's cache read costs ($0.5/M). This gives a lot of credit to the theory that Anthropic did not get much bite on Fable at its original pricing, which in turn likely places a ceiling on LLM pricing in general. Interestingly also, if you take away terminal-Bench-Science 0.1 results, it is h…

> This gives a lot of credit to the theory that Anthropic did not get much bite on Fable at its original pricing, which in turn likely places a ceiling on LLM pricing in general.

Does that mean that generally available intelligence is now constrained by Moore's law? We have to wait for the actual price to come down.

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#466

(I work at Anthropic) Beyond all the benchmarks, I think Fable 5.1 is a big improvement in writing style. It sounds a lot less stereotypically like other Claude models, has (imho) a much more natural style, and responds to my style instructions more reliably. More work to be done (and we will!) but reading better prose makes me so much happier. Another point I expect not to get much attention until it all happens at…

I have a pet theory that the Opus prose style/smell we all have grown weary of is due at least in part to the models writing more for themselves and each other than for humans. They're packing lots of signal into fewer words and they don't care if it sounds cringe because it works better as glue in long-running tasks. I'm also thinking of the 2017 novel "Void Star" where AIs who operate everything have long since lef…

ChatGpt/Codex is nowhere near the level of sloppy vomit that Claude generates, so that theory doesnt really hold up.

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#467

(I work at Anthropic) Beyond all the benchmarks, I think Fable 5.1 is a big improvement in writing style. It sounds a lot less stereotypically like other Claude models, has (imho) a much more natural style, and responds to my style instructions more reliably. More work to be done (and we will!) but reading better prose makes me so much happier. Another point I expect not to get much attention until it all happens at…

While I can't speak for everyone in academia, I personally don't feel comfortable in putting my research questions and outputs to a private website, before the idea is at least arxived. Especially as all the Fable/Mythos prompts are said to be human reviewed. So I believe that, at least in the short run, we might be seeing breakthroughs in hard open problems or in low hanging problems which are not that interesting t…

Isn't it showing a problem with an academia?

"I don't want to live in a world where someone else makes the world a better place than we do."

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#468

The price reduction comes from the cache read pricing falling from $1/M to $0.25/M, which means that Fable 5.1 now costs half of Opus's cache read costs ($0.5/M). This gives a lot of credit to the theory that Anthropic did not get much bite on Fable at its original pricing, which in turn likely places a ceiling on LLM pricing in general. Interestingly also, if you take away terminal-Bench-Science 0.1 results, it is h…

I'm a heavy user and fable is great the #1 reason I stopped using it was the horrible safegaurd filter. I found sol close enough in capability and have only been blocked when my request was an obvious offensive cyber work. Fable blocked me on almost everything. Optimizing a OS build? -> block Securing a container -> block 60% is nowhere near enough for that safegaurd system. This just means I am going to be blocked h…

I never hit Anthropic's safety filter when I'm doing something illegal, only when I'm not.

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#469
post #144

Pelicans for thinking effort low, medium, high and xhigh (that xhigh one is pretty good): https://tools.simonwillison.net/markdown-svg-renderer#url=ht... I'm still waiting for effort max to finish. EDIT: I fixed a bug in my tooling so it now records summarized reasoning traces - here's that max pelican, which is a significant improvement: https://tools.simonwillison.net/markdown-svg-renderer#url=ht... Took just under…

Do you think model trainers are pelicanmaxxing now?

Feels like it's been pretty obvious that they have been for a while now

Re: Claude Fable 5.1 and Claude Mythos 5.1

#470

> This required us to add a watermark—a numerical way of determining the likelihood that Claude was involved in writing a piece of text—to the outputs of models released after August 2, 2026. As we recently explained, this watermark is invisible to anyone who does not have the detection API. It has no practical impact on the quality or content of Claude’s outputs and contains no information about the user, their orga…

You can generate text with/without watermarking and use a detector in this tool that simulates various watermarking techniques (Claude uses SynthID-Text) using a small LLM: https://watermark.keito.me/ (disclaimer: I made it) It doesn't obviously bias the output as much as you might fear, especially in low-entropy text.
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