I mean USA just went through this when Trump team all got FISA-d and tracked. Chat control is bunch of sha hashes that match. You can basically figure out everyone who has Trump in their WhatsApp contacts and then get every message that matches Trump and no one can tell because it searches for sha(trump) not Trump. It’s perfect tool for surveillance state
ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps
461–470 of 656 posts
Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps
#462Dear citizens of the EU: If this gets pushed through, you will gradually lose control of your government much like how the people of the UK already lost control of theirs. What are you going to do when the government's interests inevitably drift out of alignment with yours? Start a political movement? You will have the police knocking on your door for criticizing the establishment. Start a revolution? You have no wea…
> Start a revolution? You have no weapons.
Always this cope from Americans. A broad revolutionary movement will have sympathisers in the military and police. They can raid the governments armouries. The IRA became infamous for arms raids.
Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps
#463Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's relevant because the guns did not stop them from being invaded, or force the invaders to leave. A poorly trained group of insurgents can't defeat a modern military in battle. Politics were ultimately the thing that won the war, and if it happens here the results will be the same. Our 'well regulated militia' of gravy seals won't even slow the military down in battle, it will be up to the citizenry to wear them d…
It has been frustrating to dialog with you...
Sorry for that. It wasn't intentional.
I do appreciate your time and the willingness to engage.
Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps
#464Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Start a revolution? You have no weapons. (...) You have neither the pen nor the sword. We still have Euros. As long as enough companies and rich folk are more on our side than theirs, the government still has some incentive to serve us. I know, I know - money and politics, wealth and power, they go together at the high end. But there is the oft forgotten long tail, the rich and powerful at the scale of a city, a ne…
> 2) Citizens here may be significantly less armed, but the same is true of government officials, and even law enforcement is significantly less armed. It kind of evens out, unless military gets involved, but at that point all bets are off - no different than in the US. I don't think that's a correct comparison. If shit ever did hit the proverbial fan, you can bet that any US military walking around an American city…
To say nothing of equipping a guerilla force in the event of a civil war. (Something nobody sane should fantasise about, by the way.)
Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps
#465Dear citizens of the EU: If this gets pushed through, you will gradually lose control of your government much like how the people of the UK already lost control of theirs. What are you going to do when the government's interests inevitably drift out of alignment with yours? Start a political movement? You will have the police knocking on your door for criticizing the establishment. Start a revolution? You have no wea…
> Start a revolution? You have no weapons. (...) You have neither the pen nor the sword. We still have Euros. As long as enough companies and rich folk are more on our side than theirs, the government still has some incentive to serve us. I know, I know - money and politics, wealth and power, they go together at the high end. But there is the oft forgotten long tail, the rich and powerful at the scale of a city, a ne…
I watched a Dutch cop discharge his gun into a crowd in 2017 or 2018 and face no consequences, so don't give me that nonsense. The State will kill you if it wants to.
Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps
#466Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Which of course never happened, as each member country retains full sovereignty in every possible way you can think of, which is actually fully enshrined in the way EU works. Which of course is false. > The principle was derived from an interpretation of the European Court of Justice, which ruled that European law has priority over any contravening national law, including the constitution of a member state itself.…
And if you read literally one paragraph from the bit that you quoted: "The majority of national courts have generally recognized and accepted this principle, except for the part where European law outranks a member state's constitution. As a result, national constitutional courts have also reserved the right to review the conformity of EU law with national constitutional law" And guess why and how they are able to do…
From my perspective it's just a way for activist lawyers and judges to force their agenda on their government. That also gives ineffective politicians a convenient excuse to why they can't do anything.
My impression is that the UK in particular has that problem. Other european countries take the more pragmatic and sane option of... simply ignoring the EU.
Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps
#467Earlier quoted context omitted.
A large portion of the population either does not believe or does not mind the violations of our constitution to achieve their desired outcomes. As an American, it came as a surprise to me that we do not, in fact, have broadly shared values about our system of governance. This year has been a devastating blow to my confidence in our democracy and the ability of people to govern themselves generally.
My read on the US is that it could be 10 or more, functional independant states, or a single massive mess, and US citizens wake up every day and commit themselves to the mess. Right wingers will look you straight in the eye and tell you that they support suppression of gun rights and speech when it hurts their enemies. Their enemies often live many states away. I have seen the entire country flip on an issue just bec…
The constitution provides no mechanism for dissolution or secession.
Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps
#468Dear citizens of the EU: If this gets pushed through, you will gradually lose control of your government much like how the people of the UK already lost control of theirs. What are you going to do when the government's interests inevitably drift out of alignment with yours? Start a political movement? You will have the police knocking on your door for criticizing the establishment. Start a revolution? You have no wea…
>You can't even organize a resistance because all channels of communication are monitored. One of the awful things about this proposed legislation is that what I quoted you saying is not true. Software like PGP is easy to use, and criminals already do. The government has absolutely no possibility of breaking RSA the way things are now, and as such scanning all messages will do nothing other than prove more definitive…
These people aren't rulers, they're public servants that have mistaken themselves for rulers.
Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps
#469Earlier quoted context omitted.
[dead]
You’re just proving his point.
Lazy.
The US believes the right of the individual to harass others based on their immutable characteristics is more important than the right of the individual to be free of harassment based on their immutable characteristics.
The UK doesn't, and that very much reflects UK vs US culture (US culture as we know being racist and divisive).
Meanwhile, the US seems to be flirting with a central idea of communism and fascism - that political criticism of the dear leader is off limits. Thus protecting the right of the (future) authoritarian (dictator) to be free of criticism.
I know which one of two actually reflects an important aspect of freedom of speech.
Rabble rousers will tell you otherwise, but the trick is to recognise they are rabble rousers.
Re: ChatControl: EU wants to scan all private messages, even in encrypted apps
#470Dear citizens of the EU: If this gets pushed through, you will gradually lose control of your government much like how the people of the UK already lost control of theirs. What are you going to do when the government's interests inevitably drift out of alignment with yours? Start a political movement? You will have the police knocking on your door for criticizing the establishment. Start a revolution? You have no wea…
Dear citizens of the US: Please stop funding, allying with and protecting the manufacturers of surveillance tools. Stop exporting Palantir products and importing privacy-destroying devices from businesses like Greyshift and Cellebrite. Insist that the US government stop shielding hackers-for-hire like NSO Group who indiscriminately lease their products for discriminatory and illegal purposes. Stop defending "OEM" con…
Collective guilt projection is incredibly unfair. What is the average US citizen expected to do in this?
I hereby promise not to buy any weapons systems from Palantir or use Cellebrite if I forget my phone's PIN code. Am I one of the good ones now?