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More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

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Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#461

Post by bigyabai »

latexr wrote: post #379
bigyabai wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's genuinely getting depressing watching HN try to justify Tim Cook's actions ad-hoc. You can't name a single ideal Apple values more than money. Soon (2028?) "Yes, we know Apple advertises to us and backdoors their services for the government. But *at least* my personal data isn't being sold, without Apple's privacy promise I would be helpless."

> It's genuinely getting depressing watching HN try to justify Tim Cook's actions ad-hoc. Your comment is absurd. I criticise Tim Cook all the time. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&qu... Try to understand what people are saying without injecting your own preconceived notions and maybe you won’t get as depressed. Making a correction about a point is not the same as defending it.

I am not attacking your character. This is specifically aimed at HN's cognitive dissonance surrounding Apple doing anything possibly bad. It is pointless to shield Tim Cook from ancillary flak, the hypocrisy here is exactly why this topic is so important to discuss. The comments here confirm that, everyone is saying this isn't what they expected. It isn't orthogonal.

> Making a correction about a point is not the same as defending it.

That is called astroturfing, and it is a deliberate bad-faith discussion tactic. If you genuinely don't think their comment is relevant to your point, then there would be no reason to write a reply to it. This is exactly the subliminal shit that depresses me, this site is whipped by Apple and will do anything except admit it.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#462

Post by msgodel »

aqme28 wrote: post #130
em500 wrote: post #129

Apple Wallet is in the App store, and the F1 ad debacle directly violates App Store guidelines https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/ ) > 4.5.4 Push Notifications must not be required for the app to function, and should not be used to send sensitive personal or confidential information. Push Notifications should not be used for promotions or direct marketing purposes unless customers have explicitly…

Interesting. I feel like this clause is violated very often by major apps: > Push Notifications should not be used for promotions or direct marketing purposes unless customers have explicitly opted in to receive them via consent language displayed in your app’s UI, and you provide a method in your app for a user to opt out from receiving such messages.

In fact that's the main selling point for developing an iPhone app rather than a web page these days.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#463

Post by rafaelmn »

rglullis wrote: post #57
rafaelmn wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean start monetizing ? I get adds for their Apple Arcade trial on top of my iOS settings main screen. I really hate Apple - but what's stopping me from moving out of the ecosystem is that nobody else builds shit that works and is on same level. The M Pro series processor is only touchable by that one AMD chip you can't get anywhere. Windows is garbage and Linux is a part time job. Android is even worse i…

> The M Pro series processor (...) even if it were the best processor to ever exist, it's not something that we can not live without. > Linux is a part time job It has been good enough for the past 15 years or so.

>It has been good enough for the past 15 years or so.

I daily drove fedora last summer for a few months and it was a joke on how unstable it was. Slack would crash when screen sharing, likewise for chrome/gmeet, camera corruption bugs. Just two days ago I was teasing a coworker on a daily that we can spot a linux user by how long it takes him to unmute himself. Chrome would randomly stop rendering all windows when watching YouToube in a separate window. KDE plasma would get messed up very frequently. Gnome was more stable but had issues with fractional scaling X11 apps on Wayland (Plasma 6 supported this). Installing a DAW took days of reading audio routing docs and trying stuff out, breaking my audio several times in the process. My LG C4 cannot be used at 4k/120Hz because you cant get HDMI 2.1 on Linux/AMD. And this is all on a well supported desktop machine. Laptop and power management was even worse last time I tried it. Hell I never had a PC laptop that managed sleep state reliably and didn't cook the battery in the backpack randomly.

I just don't have these kinds of issues with MacOS. The processor/laptops are just best on the market and it just works, support is amazing. It is hard to justify dealing with Linux desktop and PC hardware even at a price premium, but these days Apple devices are even price competitive compared to similar windows/linux machines.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#464

Post by rewgs »

surgical_fire wrote: post #426
hshshshshsh wrote: post #419

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But isn't that a bad way to live life? Spending the best years of life working a job that you don't like so that you get weekends free?

Starving is worse. Try to find a job that is tolerable and devote your free time to things that make you happy - family, friends, hobbies, etc

You're both not wrong.

What @surgical_fire is describing is the "minimum viable product" for a career. It's the thing that serves the basics on Maslow's Hierarchy.

What @hshshshshsh is describing is anything past that. We briefly exist sandwiched between two eternities -- shouldn't we care about the quality of our time during the thing that takes up the largest quantity of our time?

The problem is that, the issue that @hshshshshsh is pointing out is precisely what makes the minimum @surgical_fire is describing damn near impossible to find.

Because no one gives a shit about users, values, mission, etc, the company suffers and turns into a shit-show, incentivizing people to become more selfish so that they don't get sucked into the vortex of shit.

In order to reach the minimum of a "tolerable" job that doesn't suck up all your free time or make your time there a living hell, the company _must_ engage with at least some of what @hshshshshsh is describing.

This requires some amount of good faith from the majority involved. This is a tricky and fragile thing. It's easy to lose. And thus the cycle begins anew.

Ultimately, we need more people thinking like @hshshshshsh so that we can get what @surgical_fire is describing.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#465

Post by alwa »

keiferski wrote: post #40

Apple without Ive and Jobs increasingly has a taste problem. Everything from their ads to things like this are just in really poor taste, and aren’t something that they would have done 15 years ago because they would have thought it was beneath their brand. I like Apple, so I’m really hoping they bring on someone to solve this. Otherwise they’re on track to be the same as every other tasteless tech company. More on t…

I feel like there’s a taste aspect and also a focus/discipline kind of dimension to it. For the longest, they’d essentialize everything almost brutally: like that whole thing about the iPhone coming with no manual since you didn’t need it. The design only afforded you one right way to find and do things.

This is a toaster, it makes toast. This is Apple TV, it plays TV. This is Apple Wallet, it does what your wallet does.

And that was the magic! Of course the simplicity masked kaleidoscopic technical, commercial, and functional complexity—that’s not new!

This weird cross-promotion is the latest, most crass, symptom; but it almost reads as the metastasis of a deeper disease—namely this urge to cross-pollute between little functional fiefdoms from inside the megacorp, instead of prioritizing the perspective of one user on one tool for one purpose at a time.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#466

Post by nevitablentropy »

em500 wrote: post #129

Apple Wallet is in the App store, and the F1 ad debacle directly violates App Store guidelines https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/ ) > 4.5.4 Push Notifications must not be required for the app to function, and should not be used to send sensitive personal or confidential information. Push Notifications should not be used for promotions or direct marketing purposes unless customers have explicitly…

Never knew this before - OfferUp is a huge violator of this where they will push notification containing only advertisements with a loud notification that is identical to those used when someone makes you an offer. There is also no way to disable those promotional notifications without disabling all notifications from the app.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#467

Post by dmurray »

lxgr wrote: post #456
discostrings wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uber violates this. At least as of a few years ago, there was no way to get notifications about driver arrival without also getting special offer and Uber Eats spam notifications periodically. Not only was there no opt-in consent, there was no way to turn them off without disabling the status updates. It's particularly bad when apps with legitimate time-sensitive functionality do this. I denied the app the ability to…

So does "Too Good To Go". Missed a pickup notification because I didn't remember having angrily turned off all notifications one day, since they don't have any more fine-grained option. I let their support know, but they don't care. I guess as long as it still brings in more additional sales than it costs in lost users, it works for them. This is something I like better on Android: As far as I remember, separate "not…

I definitely get unmutable notifications on Android from my first-party phone manufacturer bloatware apps, which is the equivalent here. Would I like to see the new Themes in the Theme Marketplace?

Pretty sure I've had marketing notifications on third party apps I couldn't disable without losing functionality, too. Separate notification channels might be mandatory in theory, but even if so, the Play Store is worse at policing that kind of thing in practice than Apple.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#468

Post by msgodel »

hopelite wrote: post #255
somenameforme wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple is basically a smartphone company at this point, and smartphone sales are plummeting. And I think they're plummeting for the same reason desktop sales plummeted. We went from a time where a new PC was a bit dated in 3 months and obsolete in 2 years, to modern times where a desktop from a decade ago is good for pretty much everything, even including high end gaming if you started with a high end card. The exact…

I would say it’s simpler than that. Between Wall Street demanding “growth” and the executives’ stock options being tied to meeting those numbers, they always pull out any and all stops to push “growth”. As others have implied, with people like Jobs and others gone, there is also no cultural resistance based on core values that created Apple to push back on shameless debasement. It is also what is happening all over t…

This stupidity isn't leading to growth though. I'm actually shorting them because their inability to produce products that actually add value to their customers lives is already manifesting in earnings/sales decay.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#469

Post by mvdtnz »

Nextgrid wrote: post #414
mvdtnz wrote: post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hope this impacts current or future lawsuits regarding anticompetitive app store practices. It's a clear example of the unfair playing field Apple runs.

For better or worse, Apple doesn't enforce this on third-parties either.

You cannot possibly know that. Regardless of how many instances of infractions you know of you cannot know how many instances didn't occur because of the rule and you cannot know how the known infractions were punished by Apple behind closed doors. The very existence of this rule is what makes the playing field unfair.

Re: More on Apple's Trust-Eroding 'F1 the Movie' Wallet Ad

#470

Post by jama211 »

troupo wrote: post #121
jama211 wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They did loads of tacky things back in the day, we’ve just forgotten about them.

Modern Apple can't even do tacky things. Tacky things under Jobs were failed experiments. Modern Apple doesn't believe in either experiments or failed experiments.

Well that’s just demonstrably false, even aside from the fact that that’s a fairly large goalpost move.
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