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Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

arxiv.org

461–470 of 598 posts

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#461
I recently interviewed at Microsoft with a relatively well-known VP. I was surprised as I didn't think I was a fit in terms of domain experience, and then I was encouraged to apply online for another role with the same VP & team.

A week or two later I received rejection letters for both. It occurred to me that I might have been a stooge to make the VP's project look good on paper somehow.

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I last changed jobs, I started looking at the end of 2021. I was a staff SWE at Google, MS CS from Stanford, etc. - a good resume. I also found myself applying into a black hole. But when I used second degree connections to get someone at the company to acknowledge I existed, everything started moving, and I ended up with great offers from both the companies I had applied in. Sometimes there are ghost roles, but…

I don’t think you intended this, but it made me chuckle… Your comment essentially boils down to “come from a privileged background and things will work out”.

Tell me you don’t know how to network without explicitly saying it?

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#463

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I last changed jobs, I started looking at the end of 2021. I was a staff SWE at Google, MS CS from Stanford, etc. - a good resume. I also found myself applying into a black hole. But when I used second degree connections to get someone at the company to acknowledge I existed, everything started moving, and I ended up with great offers from both the companies I had applied in. Sometimes there are ghost roles, but…

>an internal champion. It's an interesting way to spell "corruption".

Knowing someone inside an organization is corruption?

I don’t buy it; please explain how having human connections is corrupt.

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#464
post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're largely correct, as I understand it. You cant discriminate in favor of citizens vs permanent residents unless the job legally requires citizenship.

> unless the job legally requires citizenship Can you provide any examples?

Defense.

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#465

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I last changed jobs, I started looking at the end of 2021. I was a staff SWE at Google, MS CS from Stanford, etc. - a good resume. I also found myself applying into a black hole. But when I used second degree connections to get someone at the company to acknowledge I existed, everything started moving, and I ended up with great offers from both the companies I had applied in. Sometimes there are ghost roles, but…

>an internal champion. It's an interesting way to spell "corruption".

And "corruption" is an interesting way of saying that you don't think personal connections should pay into business decisions but I realize many folks in tech roles think that way.

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#466

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>an internal champion. It's an interesting way to spell "corruption".

Knowing someone inside an organization is corruption ? I don’t buy it; please explain how having human connections is corrupt.

Because he did not get the job for what he knows, but who. Another candidate of equal knowledge, without the privilege of his connections, would not have succeeded.

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#467

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Theres like a million well qualified applicants, they arent getting hired. go read any jobs forum, people are struggling

Yes, there are more candidates to choose from today than 5 years ago, but that just leaves more candidates. The hiring bar is higher, but the proportion of good Americans doesn't get higher. Sure you can get a better American today than 2019, but you're comparing any one candidate to their competition and the company bar. If you want to deliberately hire Americans who interview worse than non Americans, you're breaki…

>If you want to deliberately hire Americans who interview worse than non Americans, you're breaking the law

This is an absurd claim.

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#468

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm the first to admit it isn't perfect, but that doesn't mean there is no net benefit. hundreds of thousands of people are paid market wages on H1B visas and many get green cards. On balance, this is good for consumers and citizens. I feel like people have a gut reaction to injustice and harm where they want to trash the whole system, not realizing that would be an even greater injustice and harm. It is a counterpro…

I do not want to "trash the whole system", but when I see laws crafted specifically and solely to depress labor prices, it is reasonable to get emotional and feel morally superior. Why else would we give work authorization to a person, but then restrict them to a single employer such as with H1-B? See also lower minimum wages and separate labor standards for poorer Mexican immigrants in agriculture, not to mention th…

> Why else would we give work authorization to a person, but then restrict them to a single employer such as with H1-B?

H1B visas are not restricted to a single employer. The catch is that the new employer is required to demonstrate the new role is valid for H1B work.

This is a control to make sure that H1-B visa holders are not underpaid or doing abusing the system.

It is a genuinely tough problem. You could decouple the H1B visa from the employer position, but then you have people entering for one type of work at market rate, and doing any type of work and undercutting salaries.

The whole employer requirement is an attempt to protect native workers. Letting H1B workers enter decoupled from a job and salary requirement would be much better for employers. They could pay them minimum wage and hire them into any role they want.

Im curious to hear ideas for how it could be structured that is better. Im sure there are options. Maybe the workers themselves could submit the info for change of employment, but I dont know how they would prove the work is at prevailing wage.

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#469

I once applied for a job that precisely matched my qualifications. It was crazy - the job description could have been written by someone looking at my CV. I didn't even get an interview. Likely no one did. It wasn't a ghost job, though. It was a position created for a someone they wanted to hire. Being a public institution, they were required to advertise positions. That didn't mean that they actually wanted any of t…

It is normal in public sector. I was offered a position in a public sector job and the supervisor gave me the keys to the office and lab and told me that due to hiring requirement blah blah, they had to put a new tender and post the position online for several days before they can declare me as the selected candidate. The contract will be delivered to me via post after the day they take down the advert.

While I felt immensely special and cool, but once I received the contract by post, one of my random friends called me o say that he needed a job badly and found this perfect opening and applied there, but he got rejected, whether I was interested to also apply for that position, the requirements looked like I would be the best fit. When he sent me the PDF, dang, it was the same job that was being posted for me and I was super sad.

I eventually did not sign the contract because the practice really felt immoral to me and recommended my friend instead. While my supervisor was super sad, because they had to go through a long process for that fake job advert, nonetheless he understood my stance and went ahead and called my friend again.

I believe these public institute jobs must post internal hires publicly to comply with certain regulations or something, but the practice is weird.

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#470
post #355

Hang on a minute. There is absolutely nothing in this research that measures the accuracy of this approach. A user saying "I was ghosted" is not, to my mind, proof of anything. Job seekers almost never actually know if the job was real or not, so it's hard to see how Glassdoor reviews can ever provide the insight this work is looking for. I do believe that "ghost" jobs exist, often for H1B purposes, but I don't think…

While I'm disappointed at the scientific merits of the paper, I'm glad it was posted here which invited discussion on this topic. Someone feeling frustrated with their job app right now might find a speculative answer here. (Currently waiting for "final decision" on 2 interviews which went well, but after 3 weeks, I'm starting to feel they're ghosting me)

The confirmation bias is certainly strong in many of the comments here, be cautious of accepting an explanation that makes you feel better over the alternatives

From the other side, they may be evaluating more candidates, hoping for a better fit. From the same side, I accepted an offer with another company after waiting for weeks for Google to respond, only to have them finally get back a couple days later. Someone dropped the ball on their end. Another interesting aspect is that I was laid off 4 weeks into my new job, only to then be hired by the team I was embedded with 2 weeks later, which goes to show you that large corps can be disorganized, so while one team is trying to hire to meet demand, the larger org is planning cuts to the workforce without giving them the heads up, while another part of the org is expanding with permission

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