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Google is already pushing WEI into Chromium

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Re: Google is already pushing WEI into Chromium

#461

Post by everdrive »

MildRant wrote: post #122
bee_rider wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hear Firefox is mismanaged all the time, but it seems to be a perfectly fine browser for the most part. I hear all about sites that won’t render in comments on this website, but they must all be internal tools or something because I never encounter them.

I sparingly run into sites that don't render properly on Firefox but they do exist. As an example, Ticketmaster's account page has problems on Firefox that I don't get on Chromium.

This is going to be a problem which compounds more as Google gains more ground. “Oh, I love internet freedom, but I really need to visit website X.” As more and more websites adopt Chrome’s standards, Chrome will be the only browser that works.

Re: Google is already pushing WEI into Chromium

#462

Post by FooBarBizBazz »

rkangel wrote: post #381
lxgr wrote: post #302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. Also, if some anecdata can help change a mind: Firefox is a really good browser these days. I use it quite heavily, and it hasn’t disappointed in the last three or so years since I switched from Chrome. About the only use case I still need Chrome for is for sites requiring experimental web APIs not supported by Firefox, such as Web USB or Web Bluetooth. Site compatibility for everything else, including very…

I switched to Firefox for the idealogical reasons above and was pleasantly surprised to find that it was a net improvement. The only site I have compatibility issues with on desktop is MS Teams and even then it's only for voice/video calls, everything else works fine. Firefox Android is a slightly less happy place. The password manager doesn't work very well (am moving away from the built-in one) and I can't log in o…

Firefox Android OOMs whenever it sees an article from The Guardian.

Re: Google is already pushing WEI into Chromium

#463

Post by dogleash »

kalleboo wrote: post #371
btown wrote: post #162

From the spec author, in 2022 [0]: > I decided to make this an app in the end. This is where my costs started wracking up. I had to pay for a second hand macbook pro to build an iOS app. Apple’s strategy with this is obvious, and it clearly works, but it still greatly upsets me that I couldn’t just build an app with my linux laptop. If I want the app to persist for longer than a month, and to make it easy for friends…

I don't think it's double-think, it's just a lack of consequential thinking. I believe the writers of the spec when they say that they just want to be able to see which ad views are real or not. They even lay out some (far too weak) ideas to keep the system from being mandatory and abusable. But they don't realize just how quickly things will go out of hand once the rest of the organization realizes what they have cr…

> it's just a lack of consequential thinking

Googlers tend to trust google, even when its readily apparent tool/system design obviously puts them in a control position above anyone else in matters that extend beyond their own walls. I've only met a few that will coyly admit they don't trust google, but maintain they have to keep up appearances.

I think it also explains their outspokenness on societal issues outside google's control. It's a distraction from thinking too hard about what societal bad google does have control over.

Re: Google is already pushing WEI into Chromium

#466

Post by FooBarBizBazz »

notpushkin wrote: post #426
coffeefirst wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. Google uses chrome-only APIs in a few of its own products and falls back not so gracefully. Which sort of underscores the monopoly point. There’s no universal free/cheap alternative to Meet, further entrenching Chromium.

How about Jitsi? https://meet.jit.si/ It's free and open source, works everywhere, has stuff like background replacement, and doesn't require signup at all.

Jitsi is super easy to use, and I still can't get older people to use it. They just hear "Zoom" on CNN so they think, "I'm supposed to use Zoom. Other things are weird." So much behavior is just driven by anxiety and habituation.

Re: Google is already pushing WEI into Chromium

#467

Post by icoder »

Alifatisk wrote: post #179
scott_joe wrote: post #171

Can someone please explain what this actually is. Without the poetry.

This is about WEI, Web environment integrity. The article below sums it up pretty good. "The proposal suggests that websites should be able to request an attestation from the browser about its “integrity”. Such attestations are to be provided by external agents, which – presumably – examine the browser and its plugins, and issue an approval only if those checks pass. The attestation is sent back to the website, which…

The way you put it, it's like a captcha (but stronger, and with a high risk of unwanted side effects)?

Re: Google is already pushing WEI into Chromium

#468

Post by JohnFen »

api wrote: post #321
doliveira wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, financial and social pressure is basically the only weapons we have against corporations when regulations don't exist. And honestly, financial pressure doesn't work at this scale or in this case.

Financial pressure won't work because you are not Google's customer. Google's customers are its advertisers.

And you are the customers of those companies advertising. That's leverage, too.

Re: Google is already pushing WEI into Chromium

#469

Post by mordae »

anshumankmr wrote: post #384
mplewis wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

WEI turns non-compliant browsers into second-class citizens. You’re perfectly free to use whatever compliant browser engine and OS combo you like today – but in a world with WEI, you’ll have to use Approved Chrome on an Approved OS on Approved Hardware with Approved Signing Keys, or you won’t be able to sign into your bank.

Approved Signing Keys -> Will this require for the end user to do it? If so, then this might be a short lived change, cause for a lot of people having a username and password is already super complicated.

Nothing special. Just use preinstalled system and don't even think about using anything else.
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