Hahahaha! 'd69:beef:cafe:feed:face:6969:0420:0001'
I spent a week without IPv4 to understand IPv6 transition mechanisms
461–470 of 511 posts
Re: I spent a week without IPv4 to understand IPv6 transition mechanisms
#462Earlier quoted context omitted.
192.168.1.2.
Error: fewer addresses than humans
There are only a few people on my LAN. For the Internet, use more groups when people need more addresses (like 8.8.8.8.3), and leave the existing addresses like 8.8.8.8 alone. This didn't have to be complicated.
Re: I spent a week without IPv4 to understand IPv6 transition mechanisms
#463Earlier quoted context omitted.
...This thread shows that the ipv6 notation is more complicated. It's good to at least use a smaller address space on a LAN like this, but I want the basic decimal notation.
Decimal is actually a nightmare for dealing with common CIDR prefixes. Would you rather write '1111111111110000' as fff0 or 65520?
Yes, which is why they shouldn't use those huge prefixes. There's an existing 32-bit address space represented nicely like 8.8.8.8 or 192.168.1.2 for local. Now that we want to extend the address space for more users, the newer ones can be like 8.8.8.8.6 without messing with the existing ones.
Oh and I'd actually prefer the 65520.
Re: I spent a week without IPv4 to understand IPv6 transition mechanisms
#464Earlier quoted context omitted.
Decimal is actually a nightmare for dealing with common CIDR prefixes. Would you rather write '1111111111110000' as fff0 or 65520?
Yes, which is why they shouldn't use those huge prefixes. There's an existing 32-bit address space represented nicely like 8.8.8.8 or 192.168.1.2 for local. Now that we want to extend the address space for more users, the newer ones can be like 8.8.8.8.6 without messing with the existing ones. Oh and I'd actually prefer the 65520.
You'd still need to upgrade and change every device. There have been transitional software that used ipv6 but allowed for ipv4 address notation. [1] Example:
::ffff:0:8.8.8.8
The huge prefixes allow for a simple hierarchical network structure and gives us room to redo the address scheme if we end up wanting to (only a portion of addresses space is currently allocated right now) without having to go through this entire upgrade the internet again.
Re: I spent a week without IPv4 to understand IPv6 transition mechanisms
#465Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Everything on my network is going to go through my firewall anyway. I don't want anything on my network to be globally routable. Globally routable ≠ globally connectible. Your (stateful) firewall will still by default block any incoming connection attempts if they are not replies to an initial outgoing connection. It's just that it will no longer be necessary to go through the rigamarole of STUN, TURN, ICE, etc, th…
> Further, because you don't have only one external IP, you don't have to futz around with non-default ports if you want multiple instances of the same service (e.g., Minecraft), because each instance can have its own IP. This is an interesting point though personally I love how easy container technologies made exposing arbitrary ports, without trying to configure the software itself, or checking whether it even supp…
But the things connecting to them need to know which non-default ports to use!
The Gods intended for each database service to have its own IP address and I curse the market forces that have trapped so many of us in the quagmire of NAPT!
Re: I spent a week without IPv4 to understand IPv6 transition mechanisms
#466Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Everything on my network is going to go through my firewall anyway. I don't want anything on my network to be globally routable. Globally routable ≠ globally connectible. Your (stateful) firewall will still by default block any incoming connection attempts if they are not replies to an initial outgoing connection. It's just that it will no longer be necessary to go through the rigamarole of STUN, TURN, ICE, etc, th…
How does that protect privacy of the private network? I don't want to divulge any information about internal topology.
See RFC 8981 (and that which it made obsolete, RFC 4941).
Re: I spent a week without IPv4 to understand IPv6 transition mechanisms
#467Earlier quoted context omitted.
Your machines could change their IPs for every second of every day and you wouldn't come close to exhausting your /64 subnet for the next billion years.
Won't this break your TCP connections? NAT won't, because it's connection-aware by its nature. And you also get a new "address"(=port) on each new connection, regardless of any setting.
Deprecated addresses still work, they just aren't removed from an interface until there are no more sockets using them.
(Hand waving a bit here with terminology don't shoot me)
Re: I spent a week without IPv4 to understand IPv6 transition mechanisms
#468Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Since DHCPv6 is apparently frowned upon by v6 purists, and not all devices on my network support it, that leaves SLAAC. The main hold out against DHCPv6 is Android: * https://issuetracker.google.com/issues/36949085
that thread is amazing. Google's stance makes me want to deploy DHCPv6 simply to spite them. I guarantee in 10 years when some Fortune 500 company or top 20 research university IT department, who has no idea about that thread, goes live with a DHCPv6-only IPv6 stack because it's very similar to their IPv4 network, and 30,000 users can't join their Android devices to the campus wifi, this attitude will change
A conference wlan with google engineers attending might be more impactful.
Complains by them? Won't fix (Intended behavior)
Re: I spent a week without IPv4 to understand IPv6 transition mechanisms
#469Earlier quoted context omitted.
With the home router+wifi market estimated to be USD 2070.43 million in 2022, I wouldn't say it's a tiny percentage of people, just people you know.
Most people don't buy their own router, the ISPs bulk buy thousands of routers at a time. The ISPs make up most of the market. Many of these routers are managed by the ISP using protocols such as TR-069, several ISPs have already been found to not only manage the devices but also monitor certain data including what devices are present.
This is pure anecdata, but almost everyone I know, include the people who aren't particularly computer-savvy, owns their own router and cable modem so that they don't have to pay a rental fee to their ISP.
Re: I spent a week without IPv4 to understand IPv6 transition mechanisms
#470Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Globally routable ≠ globally connectible Tell us with the next 0 day, because that big problem exist, and unfortunately happens every days. IPv6 == All your devices are globally ROUTABLE and CONNECTIBLE from Internet, your home network is part of internet. It is an additional rule in the router's firewall what temporarily avoids it. Remark in temporarily, as one day the gifted packet will arrive to the router. This…
I don't even necessarily disagree with you, but your examples don't seem accurate. Regarding firewalls bring prone to accepting by default, either way the packet has to go through the CPU to be routed. I don't believe there's any inherent bias in the design. You could argue that routers that use a single switch and vlan isolate the wan port are inherently biased, though. Regarding local hostname resolution, there are…
The words "local" or "home" network with IPv6 are an illusion, this is what I wanted to show with my examples,
Firstly one ceases to have control of its own home network, what now have to rely on the ISP for to receive the "local" IPs, what are part of internet. And in addition each machine leaves a trace of its "local" ip on the Internet. This if one want internet access in the device, due the absence of NAT in the router's protocol.
Secondly one have to rely on a buggy piece of code called firewall for to make "local" those IPs, due the absence of NAT in the router's protocol.
https://nvd.nist.gov/vuln/search/results?form_type=Basic&res...
https://www.cvedetails.com/google-search-results.php?q=firew...
We are talking about millions of routers provided by the ISPs in each country, barely maintained and updated, what little by little will become exposed. And this without taking in account the unpublished firewall bugs that each artist keeps for themselves and takes 3 to 5 years become detected and fixed by the mainstream. I do not know how to express the negligence is going on, but I can see that Crackers, Advertisers (privacy) and "others" are in good time because things are getting more easier for them than it should be.
Why people keep down-voting the message is a mystery for me. If it is due the local hostname resolution, mDNS, ULA prefixes, etc, all are workarounds due it is a network one does not control, what is one of the main points I exposed (it also needs filters/rules what needs be manually added in the firewall, each user has to make efforts to try to protect the supposed "from internet" separation).
One could create another network as you said, but the main problem keep existing without NAT.