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Atlassian is 20 years old and unprofitable

smartcompany.com.au

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Re: Atlassian is 20 years old and unprofitable

#461

Post by forgingahead »

mistrial9 wrote: post #385
dalbasal wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea that growth is better than profits was in-built into Atlassian's proposition to shareholders, ultimately. The slow and steady mentality is fine, but we see over and over that it isn't what the market wants. A private company or a high risk growth company, those are the two options for a software company. Either that or they'll be taken over. They're revenue now is just a $2bn, so that "grow grow" mindset fro…

> revenue now is just a $2bn "only" $2bn ? this is bizarre to see discussed without question

Probably because the valuation is currently 10x revenue, and was previously more like 70x. "Only" is probably because the parent still feels like Atlassian is highly over-valued.

Re: Atlassian is 20 years old and unprofitable

#462

Post by [deleted] »

felixnm wrote: post #452
nickjj wrote: post #134

Somehow I'm not surprised. A few days ago[0] I was writing a Jira ticket after hitting the "Create" button and I wrote the description (the body of the ticket) for ~30 minutes. I switched the ticket type from A to B (no epics involved) and it wiped out the entire description. All I did was select a different item in a select drop down box provided by the form's UI. There was no warning it would clear the description…

I can understand your frustration, and there should be some warning, but this is not a bug. Every issue type is configured with its associated issue-create screen and that screen has its fields. When you change the issue type during issue creation you're replacing one set of fields with another which results in the information loss you experienced. This just doesn't affect the description field, but all other system…

[deleted]

Re: Atlassian is 20 years old and unprofitable

#463

Post by dzikimarian »

sien wrote: post #28

So with Slack there is Mattermost and Zulip. What are the equivalents for Jira ? Is there an openish source piece of similar software ? Jira cops a lot of hate on HN, but really to paraphrase Churchill on Democracy - "Jira is the worst issue tracking software, except for all the others". The comparison on Wikipedia has so many of them : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_issue-tracking_s... Are any of them a…

Anybody uses youtrack? Seems quite nice and has self hosted option, which is sadly rare trait.

Re: Atlassian is 20 years old and unprofitable

#464

Post by formula1_sw »

julian_digital wrote: post #338
livinglist wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two startups I’ve worked for uses Linear as well, but is it really scalable though? Like is there any big company (200+) using Linear?

[I work for Linear] Yes, we have multiple scale-up/enterprise customers with 200+ users

No post body was provided.

Re: Atlassian is 20 years old and unprofitable

#465

Post by mikeywazowski »

pm wrote: post #435
res0nat0r wrote: post #405

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are lots of alternatives out there looking for marksetshare. I've not personally used ClickUp but it looks fantastic just from their screenshots: https://clickup.com/features https://clickup.com/blog/jira-alternatives/

ClickUp is a confusing mess. It tries to be the centre of your universe without doing anything particularly well. It copies features verbatim from other software and then slams it in as a new "view". The coding doesn't seem to be up to scratch either, e.g., updating a value won't always update it everywhere it's displayed. It's very hit-and-miss. I had a look at Asana again for non-software project management after d…

I agree. We used ClickUp at my old work, and I felt like I was the only person who found it extremely unintuitive and confusing. It was about the 5th project management app they switched to, and the worst for me by far. Unfortunately they stuck with it until I left.

Re: Atlassian is 20 years old and unprofitable

#466

Post by 015a »

sien wrote: post #28

So with Slack there is Mattermost and Zulip. What are the equivalents for Jira ? Is there an openish source piece of similar software ? Jira cops a lot of hate on HN, but really to paraphrase Churchill on Democracy - "Jira is the worst issue tracking software, except for all the others". The comparison on Wikipedia has so many of them : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_issue-tracking_s... Are any of them a…

Linear & Shortcut are both significantly better. Linear isn't even in the same realm as Jira in quality and productivity; its like comparing Excel to Jira, yeah you can make Excel work but you'd be out of your mind to use it for something like project management. Similarly, with the advent of Linear; you'd be out of your mind to greenfield on Jira. Why not spin up OracleSQL and write your app in C++ while you're at it?

Gitlab & Github issues is also pretty solid. Lightweight, but it works for what it does.

Asana is another decent competitor, though I don't tend to recommend them for project management. Its there though.

I've organized some small software teams using Notion. Its surprisingly functional. The big downside is the lack of universal structure or a decent API to even build your own analytics against; great for the ICs, but not great for managers.

Re: Atlassian is 20 years old and unprofitable

#467

Post by BeFlatXIII »

felixnm wrote: post #452
nickjj wrote: post #134

Somehow I'm not surprised. A few days ago[0] I was writing a Jira ticket after hitting the "Create" button and I wrote the description (the body of the ticket) for ~30 minutes. I switched the ticket type from A to B (no epics involved) and it wiped out the entire description. All I did was select a different item in a select drop down box provided by the form's UI. There was no warning it would clear the description…

I can understand your frustration, and there should be some warning, but this is not a bug. Every issue type is configured with its associated issue-create screen and that screen has its fields. When you change the issue type during issue creation you're replacing one set of fields with another which results in the information loss you experienced. This just doesn't affect the description field, but all other system…

Still a bug of unexpected behavior for a user. The easiest fix is a warning pop-up that changing forms will clear all information currently typed.

Re: Atlassian is 20 years old and unprofitable

#468

Post by time_to_smile »

mbesto wrote: post #400
dalbasal wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea that growth is better than profits was in-built into Atlassian's proposition to shareholders, ultimately. The slow and steady mentality is fine, but we see over and over that it isn't what the market wants. A private company or a high risk growth company, those are the two options for a software company. Either that or they'll be taken over. They're revenue now is just a $2bn, so that "grow grow" mindset fro…

> They're revenue now is just a $2bn And has been growing 30% YoY for the last 3~4 years alone. This is unheard of in any other industry/market. Their FCF is also impressive.

> And has been growing 30% YoY for the last 3~4 years alone.

Growing revenue while still not making a profit is not impressive. If you give me $100 today I can go out a buy $100 a pair of new shoes, and sell it for $70. Give me $200 and I'll go out and by two pairs of shoes and sell them for both $84 (total)! Keep giving me money and you'll continue to see this growth I promise!

> This is unheard of in any other industry/market

Given my example above, that should be a warning, not a sign of success.

I find it mind-boggling that people can really not even grasp that growing revenue with out demonstrating you can transform that revenue into profit doesn't mean all the much.

Grow profits every year by 30% and I'll be impressed.

Re: Atlassian is 20 years old and unprofitable

#469

Post by mrelliot »

mr90210 wrote: post #38
sien wrote: post #28

So with Slack there is Mattermost and Zulip. What are the equivalents for Jira ? Is there an openish source piece of similar software ? Jira cops a lot of hate on HN, but really to paraphrase Churchill on Democracy - "Jira is the worst issue tracking software, except for all the others". The comparison on Wikipedia has so many of them : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_issue-tracking_s... Are any of them a…

As a programmer, I actually like Jira. It works.

Considering the amount of money you pay to have it, "it works" is not even the bare minimum. Lot of things work.

The problem with Jira is the total disregard for UX. Very simple tasks like moving tickets out of a story take way too many steps when it should take one click.

They don't seem to want to improve it because of legacy customer or reasons....

Re: Atlassian is 20 years old and unprofitable

#470

Post by ryanackley »

tablespoon wrote: post #347
ryanackley wrote: post #107

Worked there from 2008-2013. So early-ish employee here. I still have a chunk of shares from the original ESOP program. Saying that for full disclosure because I'm biased and this feels like a hit piece to me. When I worked there, they disclosed all financials in our internal Confluence site. There was a policy of full transparency with the employees. The owners (Mike and Scott) had impressive business discipline. Th…

> Doug Berman, the founder of Great Plains software I believe that's Doug Burgum (now governor of North Dakota).

Yes, you're right! I realized my mistake and tried to go back and edit it at some point but I guess there is a time limit on edits.
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