Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever • Hacker News Board

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#461

Post by pbuzbee » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:42 PM UTC

joeblau wrote: post #65

Random diamond story! As a freshman in college, I took a geology class and our teacher asked all of the women in our class to raise their hand if they would rather have natural or human-made diamonds. Most of the women (over 80%) raised their hands for natural. The reasons they gave all seemed to tie back to branding and natural diamonds being “real.” Then our teacher gave another analogy. He asked if people would ra…

The root of it, I think, is that mined diamonds are the standard for engagement rings. Culturally, having a mined diamond is (for many/most Americans) table stakes for what an engagement ring should be.

Getting a lab grown diamond or an alternative stone for your girlfriend can feel like you chose saving money or your personal views on diamond ethics over getting her something that meets those table stakes. It doesn't matter if it's technically superior (I rarely hear people discuss the quality of their diamonds anyway, beyond weight occasionally). What does matter is that you chose to give her something different than the standard, and the ring will always feel like it has a little asterisk on it marking this.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#462

Post by chongli » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:45 PM UTC

ashtonkem wrote: post #304

rlv-dan wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do people pay insane amount for a box copy of Super Mario Bros, a game you can play one pretty much any device. ROM dumps are literary the same data. I guess rarity is hard to set a price on. And people like being rare and unique.

Original Super Mario Bros carts are rare, diamonds are not. Natural diamonds have an artificially reduced supply thanks to a cartel, if their market actually functioned they’d be very cheap.

The original Super Mario Bros sold ~40 million copies, excluding all the re-releases. It’s not a rare game at all. You can buy the cartridges on eBay for less than $10. Complete in box versions for a few hundred at most.

The only thing rare about this big sale is that it’s sealed in the box in perfect condition. All that extra money just for packaging material. Collectors are truly weird.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#463

Post by amiga » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:47 PM UTC

NikolaeVarius wrote: post #412

washadjeffmad wrote: post #406

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I went through this not that many years ago buying a ring for my SO. My biggest mistake was including her in the decision. She described what she wanted exactly– nothing gaudy or ostentatious, just a singular, tasteful stone on a plain band. Couldn't be simpler, could it? Finding stones that met her criteria was easy. Some were natural diamonds, some lab grown, many moissanite. From the outset, she said the meaning o…

Its amazing how much society can make people believe such stupid illogical things

Where do you draw the line between marketing vs flat out lies? There's a conflict of interest between consumer and sales person.

I just tire of the subterfuge.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#464

Post by boatsie » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:47 PM UTC

I find it ironic that many people in this thread are extolling the virtues of lab grown diamonds, as they are nearly indistinguishable from natural ones and cost around 50% less. But they still cost quite a bit, whereas cubic zirconia is also nearly indistinguishable to the naked untrained eye and cost a tiny fraction of that cost.

Those who see value in a synthetic diamond over a CZ should also see the value some perceive in a natural diamond over a synthetic. And those who see value in a CZ over nothing at all should see why some value a synthetic diamond and so on.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#465

Post by rmah » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:47 PM UTC

sopooneo wrote: post #325

GordonS wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I personally fully agree, but unfortunately not everyone thinks as logically as you or I. I talked about this with my wife recently, and even though she had a vague idea of the horrors that mined diamonds bring, she'd still continue to buy/want mined diamonds. She sees mined diamonds as more "real", and finds it difficult to believe that her diamonds in particular would be part of the problem - as if it somehow would…

My guess is that we need a sweeping, emotion-fill, romantic story toward something else, not just away from the current diamond-status quo. There certainly is a quiet satisfaction, and clear conscience, in avoidance of evil. But no joy in the act of NOT. A normal person who repeatedly throws aside a full heart in favor of facts will not wake up singing for many years. There needs to be a new song to replace the old,…

This is quite insightful. I never thought of it this way but I think you are correct.

If I could rephrase it a bit more clinically, the signaling of fitness (wealth, social status, etc) is important to the human mating rituals. And diamonds are integral to that in a some cultures. That underlying need is probably innate will not change. Therefore, as you said, you can't just say "NO", it needs to be replaced with something else.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#466

Post by dec0dedab0de » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:48 PM UTC

danbruc wrote: post #457

dec0dedab0de wrote: post #433

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would have immediately ended it right there, but that's probably why I'm single. Every time I was in a relationship long enough to discuss marriage, I made it clear that there is no way I would ever buy a diamond. Only one was actively on board with it, because she liked the idea of picking out an alternative gem.

Take the money and have a nice honeymoon, buy two $5 seashell necklace at the beach. There are so many ways to spend hundreds or thousands of dollars that are way better than investing them into small chunks of metal.

Take the money and have a nice honeymoon, buy two $5 seashell necklace at the beach. There are so many ways to spend hundreds or thousands of dollars that are way better than investing them into small chunks of metal.

Agreed, but I was OK with spending the money, what really bothers me is how worthless diamonds are. Metals have a relatively free market, many uses, and are fungible, so the pricing is more in line with reality.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#467

Post by [deleted] » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:48 PM UTC

literallycancer wrote: post #446

the_local_host wrote: post #430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Equivalent is not as good when what matters is what other people think. Even if the person displaying a luxury artifact agrees that some other artifact is equivalent, if the people they're displaying it to don't also agree, then there is a difference that's relevant to the purpose of the artifact, which is to advertise your wealth. Though the topic at hand is diamonds, which are strongly associated with wedding propo…

You could just use an artificial stone and no one would know. If you just care about the signal, buy good replicas of things you could plausibly afford, how hard can it be.

[deleted]

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#468

Post by zhobbs » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:49 PM UTC

username90 wrote: post #283

gtirloni wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just bought it and moved on. I'm happy that she's happy. I couldn't care less.

You are the ideal consumer. Hope you realize why it would be bad if everyone was like you.

Can you elaborate? As far as I can tell, effectively everyone is like this...

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#469

Post by woofcat » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:53 PM UTC

sneak wrote: post #421

woofcat wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I'm not understanding a lot of the sentiment here. I suppose if you're a fresh grad, or not making a ton of money. However if an engagement ring's cost is some barrier to getting married... perhaps you're too young to get married? Life is expensive, and between cars, house, the actual wedding, kids, etc. The money I spent on my wives engagement ring seems like child's play. Also I feel like most women want it,…

> Life is expensive, and between cars, house, the actual wedding, kids, etc. The money I spent on my wives engagement ring seems like child's play. I wonder if your literal children would feel like that if you'd taken the same money for a ring that will (presuming you proceed with marriage) pretty much never get worn, and invested it in an index fund until their 21st birthday. "child's play" indeed is what I would ca…

>I wonder if your literal children would feel like that if you'd taken the same money for a ring that will (presuming you proceed with marriage) pretty much never get worn, and invested it in an index fund until their 21st birthday.

I don't know what culture you're from. But in North America engagement rings are worn as every day jewellery. So it gets used daily.

>I wonder if your literal children would feel like that if you'd taken the same money for a ring that will (presuming you proceed with marriage) pretty much never get worn, and invested it in an index fund until their 21st birthday.

I guess you're presuming that because I spent money on one thing... I'm unable to spend money on another thing? Do you apply the same logic to everything in your life? "I really should have gone with the cheapest clothing available as then I could have saved $x towards my children's future!"

Regardless my children do in fact have investment accounts opened in their names and invested in index funds, and I don't regret buying my wife a nice engagement ring, our our Audi, or our house, etc etc. I hope if you get married you don't put every expense through the view point of "If I invested this for 21 years!" as you'd never take a day of vacation, or enjoy yourself. :)

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#470

Post by the_local_host » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:56 PM UTC

literallycancer wrote: post #446

the_local_host wrote: post #430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Equivalent is not as good when what matters is what other people think. Even if the person displaying a luxury artifact agrees that some other artifact is equivalent, if the people they're displaying it to don't also agree, then there is a difference that's relevant to the purpose of the artifact, which is to advertise your wealth. Though the topic at hand is diamonds, which are strongly associated with wedding propo…

You could just use an artificial stone and no one would know. If you just care about the signal, buy good replicas of things you could plausibly afford, how hard can it be.

Not everyone is comfortable with the risk that the truth might eventually come out.

What some intrepid manufacturer should do is create custom diamonds that are actually more expensive than natural diamonds, with some subtle structure that cannot be found in nature. That solves the problem of immoral sourcing, and better suits the purpose of displaying wealth.