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Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

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Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#461

Post by jhayward »

merdadicapra wrote: post #183
kumarvvr wrote: post #156

Somewhere, the collective whos who of the silicon chip world is shitting their pants. Apple just showed to the world how powerful and efficient processors can be. All that with good design. Customers are going to demand more from Intel and the likes. Just imagine Apple releasing the Mx chips for server infrastructure. Intel ought to be sweating bullets now. edit: a word.

1 - Apple is not going to enter the server market ever again, especially not the generalist cloud infrastructure 2 - 90% of the laptops sold Worldwide aren't Apple laptops, most of them are sub $500 laptops. Amazon best selling is ASUS Laptop L210 Ultra Thin Laptop, 11.6” HD Display, Intel Celeron N4020 Processor, 4GB RAM, 64GB Storage priced at $199 Basically only Mac users who upgraded to M1 are going to notice the…

> 2 - 90% of the laptops sold Worldwide aren't Apple laptops,

This is perhaps the wrong metric to look at. What % of total profit is Apple capturing? Several years ago the accepted wisdom in phones was that Apple was getting ~30% of the unit volume and 90% of the profit.

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#462

Post by Jetrel »

whatever1 wrote: post #311
homarp wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and this is now called Electron trading speed of development with 'hardware optimization'. Mac being a small market, some users are still opiniated/loud enough to reward nicer/native UI vs cross-ish platform lowest common denominator UI. Maybe there is hope Arm mac stays fast.

I would say that 90% of my pc resources are consumed to execute JavaScript code. If we need dedicated hardware to execute this more efficiently so be it. We do it anyway for so many other domains. Video, graphics, encryption etc.

One of the big deals with electron-et-al is that we're not married to JavaScript, really; we're married to "the DOM and css" as our gui, and things like FF/Chrome/Safari devtools to develop that gui.

Most javascript developers are already using babel-et-al pipelines to build electron apps, which are already transpiling between major variants of javascript, and I wouldn't at all surprised to see a thing where it gets compiled into WebAssembly rather than interpreting javascript. I also think there's a thing, right now, where it's possible to build electron apps with Rust+WebASM; I'm not sure, but I think the main thrust here is it definitely would eliminate a huge chunk of the slowdown.

I guess the main takeaway is just that the development revolution that's happened recently is mainly about how insanely good browser dev tools have become, and not about javascript - javascript was just along for the ride. As an aside - I recently saw a video of someone demoing one of the old Symbolics LISP workstations, and I was shocked to realize how much they had in common with a modern browser console - specifically of being able to inspect all of your gui components, live, and look at all the properties set on them. It's provided a hell of a way for me to explain what the deal was with all the old gurus in the 80s "AI Winter" diaspora who were pretty butthurt about having to move from programming in that environment, to having to write C on DOS (or whatever else paid the bills at the time).

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#463

Post by sunstone »

amelius wrote: post #377
kumarvvr wrote: post #156

Somewhere, the collective whos who of the silicon chip world is shitting their pants. Apple just showed to the world how powerful and efficient processors can be. All that with good design. Customers are going to demand more from Intel and the likes. Just imagine Apple releasing the Mx chips for server infrastructure. Intel ought to be sweating bullets now. edit: a word.

> Just imagine Apple releasing the Mx chips for server infrastructure. Intel ought to be sweating bullets now. As a developer, I'm sweating bullets. Imagine a future where Apple is the only serious platform left on mobile, server and desktop, then developers can forget about starting that next disruptive startup and instead they will become just second-class Apple "employees" with contracts similar to Uber drivers.

I'm sure linux will run on these chips as well. If I'm not mistaken linux has already booted on the M1.

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#464

Post by lostgame »

johnwalkr wrote: post #324
dcchambers wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I guess 'M1X' vs 'M2' doesn't matter so much. As long as they've had time to work out any kinks from the first gen and increase the RAM, I'm all in.

There's missing features (like number of USB ports) but no real kinks that I've come across. Although I don't need it, I tried parallels + ARM windows + x86 windows apps on a lark and it worked without any noticable performance issues.

Whoa. That's excellent to hear.

Since they are non-upgradeable, I will certainly be waiting until a unit with at least 32GB RAM (ideally 64GB) before I'd upgrade at all and consider it future-proofed, but this is great to know!

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#465

Post by phkahler »

dsr_ wrote: post #217
solarkraft wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> how does it overall feel e.g. in font quality? > they are grainy up close Hmm, maybe it's its "TV-ness", but the individual pixels look pretty sharp to me at a close look (no quantum dots or weird pentile arrangement, that should definitely be looked out for), but I have no other low DPI display to compare it to. My reasoning was always "it's just an LCD panel, why would it be different" and so far I feel proven ri…

It's best for your eyes to change focal distance. Staring off into infinity, staring at 75cm, and staring at 30cm are all bad for you. Find something else to look at every so often. There are few differences between a 4K 42" screen and 4 1080P 21" screens: the smaller screens can be angled, they have bezels, and are probably more expensive in aggregate.

I use a 55" Curved Samsung 4K TV. The DPI is similar to a 24" 1080p in a 2x2 configuration. The curve provides a similar effect to turning 2 monitors toward the viewer. I don't use the height very often, as I have progressive lenses and have to really look up to see the top. But I can lean back for watching a full screen video quite comfortably. IMHO it's fantastic. For those that can still see a difference in Hi-DPI an 8K 55" would be for them. I really don't need it though and this thing costs about $600 at Wallmart.

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#466

Post by Tepix »

amelius wrote: post #377
kumarvvr wrote: post #156

Somewhere, the collective whos who of the silicon chip world is shitting their pants. Apple just showed to the world how powerful and efficient processors can be. All that with good design. Customers are going to demand more from Intel and the likes. Just imagine Apple releasing the Mx chips for server infrastructure. Intel ought to be sweating bullets now. edit: a word.

> Just imagine Apple releasing the Mx chips for server infrastructure. Intel ought to be sweating bullets now. As a developer, I'm sweating bullets. Imagine a future where Apple is the only serious platform left on mobile, server and desktop, then developers can forget about starting that next disruptive startup and instead they will become just second-class Apple "employees" with contracts similar to Uber drivers.

I think companies such as Tenstorrent have a good shot at disrupting the semiconductor industry once again with their AI chips

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#467

Post by enos_feedler »

nexuist wrote: post #383
amelius wrote: post #377

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Just imagine Apple releasing the Mx chips for server infrastructure. Intel ought to be sweating bullets now. As a developer, I'm sweating bullets. Imagine a future where Apple is the only serious platform left on mobile, server and desktop, then developers can forget about starting that next disruptive startup and instead they will become just second-class Apple "employees" with contracts similar to Uber drivers.

Apple isn't harnessing magic here. The opportunity for competition exists, but everyone else is just sitting on their asses while Apple's chip team puts in the work. If you want to beat Mx, you have to think outside the box, just like how Apple thought outside of x86. That being said, I do enjoy the shift to ARM as the dominant arch. x86 has far too many decades of cruft behind it. I don't think Apple will take over…

"The opportunity for competition exists" is the most true statement and response to everyone grumbling about Apple dominance. Somewhere, somehow, the ecosystem of competitors has failed to execute, got lazy, etc and now is looking to regulators to bail them out. It makes me a bit sick. Apple is nothing more than a computing stack wrapped in a portfolio of consumer products. They happen to see this future early, invested aggressively in it, from silicon to security and everyone got caught with their pants down.

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#468

Post by hu3 »

Synaesthesia wrote: post #331
NelsonMinar wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would Apple build fancy graphics cards? They have no meaningful gaming market and haven't cared about it for years. For machine learning?

They already have. Their integrated graphics now rival that of discrete gaming laptops.

Rival how?

A Surface Book 3 with an intel processor and an outdated Nvidia 1650 TI laps around M1 in games. Almost 2x performance. I'm not even going to compare it to laptops with modern GPUs.

https://www.anandtech.com/show/16252/mac-mini-apple-m1-teste...

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#469

Post by neogodless »

elcomet wrote: post #460
hugi wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed. It's interesting to see how people like to label Apple a monopoly - a company with a 19% market share in smartphones and an 8% share on the desktop.

in the world sure, but it's a different story in the US.

About 15% of personal computers in the U.S. now.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/576473/united-states-qua...

Re: Apple's follow-up to M1 chip goes into mass production for Mac

#470

Post by amelius »

sunstone wrote: post #463
amelius wrote: post #377

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Just imagine Apple releasing the Mx chips for server infrastructure. Intel ought to be sweating bullets now. As a developer, I'm sweating bullets. Imagine a future where Apple is the only serious platform left on mobile, server and desktop, then developers can forget about starting that next disruptive startup and instead they will become just second-class Apple "employees" with contracts similar to Uber drivers.

I'm sure linux will run on these chips as well. If I'm not mistaken linux has already booted on the M1.

For now. What happens when Linux or software that runs on Linux starts competing more broadly with Apple?
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