Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

stackoverflow.blog

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

461–470 of 681 posts

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#461

Post by JeanMarcS »

paloaltokid wrote: post #441
zelly wrote: post #394

Main benefits of Kubernetes: • Lets companies brag about having # many production services at any given time • Company saves money by not having to hire Linux sysadmins • Company saves money by not having to pay for managed cloud products if they don't want to • Declarative, version controlled, git-blameable deployments • Treating cloud providers like cattle not pets It's going to eat the world (already has?). I was…

I've never coded in C++, so I'm curious - what is the feedback loop like? My understanding is that since C++ is a compiled language, you can't "hit refresh" the same way you can in JavaScript/Ruby/etc. Is that an incorrect understanding? I know C++ is supposed to be great for performance, but in truth I've never needed anything to be that fast. And if I can get the job done just as well with something I already know,…

> I've never needed anything to be that fast

In a world where you are billed by ressources used, wouldn’t it be a good idea to have light and fast services that don’t consume those ressources ?

I’ve been wondering this for a time now.

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#462

Post by demosito666 »

roman_sf wrote: post #264
geofft wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ansible is YAML, but it's definitely imperative YAML - each YAML file is a list of steps to execute. It uses YAML kind of like how Lisp uses S-expressions, as a nice data structure for people to write code in, but it's still code. Sure, the steps are things like "if X hasn't been done yet, do it." That means it's idempotent imperative code. It doesn't mean it's declarative. CFEngine is slightly less imperative, but w…

I agree. It is impressive how much it can orchestrate. It is also very useless in the real cloud because developers there are dealing with higher-level abstractions to solve problems for the business. The most simplistic task - execute some code in response to even in a bucket - makes kubernetes with all its sophisticated convergence capabilities completely useless. And even if somebody figures this out and puts the…

> The most simplistic task - execute some code in response to even in a bucket - makes kubernetes with all its sophisticated convergence capabilities completely useless.

That's because you're not thinking web^Wcloud scale. To execute some code in response to event you need:

- several workers that will poll the source bucket for changes (of course you could've used existing notification mechanism like aws eventBridge, but that will couple you k8s to vendor-specific infra, so it kinda deminishes the point of k8s)

- distributed message bus with persistanse layer. Kafka will work nicely because they say so on Medium, even though it's not designed for this use case

- a bunch of stateless consumers for the events

- don't forget that you'll need to write processing code with concurrency in mind because you're actually executing it in truly destributed system at this point and you've made a poor choice for your messaging system

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#463

Post by zerubeus »

sev wrote: post #177
tristor wrote: post #118

The simple answer is that Kubernetes isn't really any of the things it's been described as. What it /is/, though, is an operating system for the Cloud. It's a set of universal abstraction layers that can sit on top of and work with any IaaS provider and allows you to build and deploy applications using infrastructure-as-code concepts through a standardized and approachable API. Most companies who were late on the Clo…

I think this is a good answer. I'll add that as soon as you need to do something slightly more complex, without something like k8s you aren't going to be happy with your life. With k8s, it's almost a 1 liner. For example, adding a load balancer or a network volume or nginx or an SSL cert or auto scaling or...or...or...

You can use something like dokku for most of what you cited for much less overhead, if you are not planning to use the "highly available" feature for sure

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#464

Post by cyberpunk »

silviogutierrez wrote: post #19
sp332 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've just started to look into it, but it seems like the project has been focusing on improving the onboarding experience since it has a reputation for being a huge pain to set up. Do you think it has gotten easier lately?

No. Not easier in my opinion. And some of the fires you only learn after getting burnt badly . [1] Note: my experience was all with cloud-provided Kubernetes, never running my own. So it was already an order of magnitude easier. Can't even imagine rolling my own. [2] [1] My personal favorite. Truly egregious, despite how amazing k8s is. https://github.com/kubernetes/kubernetes/issues/63371#issuec... [2] https://githu…

Rancher makes this quite painless; worth a look if you have to run on prem, or in an iaas cloud for some reason.

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#465

Post by Sherl »

mfer wrote: post #113
silviogutierrez wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So terraform is a higher-order, meta-Kubernetes. It's very rarely used, but who provisions the cluster itself? That's terraform. So terraform creates the cluster, DNS and VPC. Then k8s runs pretty much everything.

How are you deploying the workloads into the cluster? Manual kubectl or Helm, GitOps with something like Flux, something else?

Some others are Tekton, Argo, KNative You could also use Jenkins with K8s deploy plugin (from MS Azure Devops team)

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#466

Post by pojzon »

dijit wrote: post #196
geggam wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean you dont like 3+ layers of Nat VIA iptables ?

That's already happening anyway.

But mostly you are not responsible for those components or are using hardware solutions which are 1000 times more efficient/performant ?

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#467

Post by physicles »

sdan wrote: post #88
UweSchmidt wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With "Swarm", do you mean Docker Swarm? Why has it "fizzled"? The way I learned it in Bret Fisher's Udemy course, Swarm is very much relevant, and will be supported indefinitely. It seems to be a much simpler version of Kubernetes. It has both composition in YAML files (i.e. all your containers together) and the distribution over nodes. What else do you need before you hit corporation-scale requirements?

I use Swarm in production and am learning k8s as fast as possible because of how bad Swarm is: 1. Swarm is dead in the water. No big releases/development afaik recently 2. Swarm for me has been a disaster because after a couple of days some of my nodes slowly start failing (although they’re perfectly normal) and I have to manually remove each node from the swarm, join them, and start everything up again. I think this…

This happened to me too when I was using swarm in 2017. Had to debug swarm networks where nodes could send packets one way but not the other. Similar problems as #2 where stuff just breaks and resetting the node is the quickest way I found to fix it.

Switched to k8s in late 2017 and it’s been much more solid. And that’s where the world has moved, so I’m not sure why you’d choose swarm anymore.

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#468

Post by rocho »

zelly wrote: post #394

Main benefits of Kubernetes: • Lets companies brag about having # many production services at any given time • Company saves money by not having to hire Linux sysadmins • Company saves money by not having to pay for managed cloud products if they don't want to • Declarative, version controlled, git-blameable deployments • Treating cloud providers like cattle not pets It's going to eat the world (already has?). I was…

I don't agree with the last paragraph.

Your C++ example is orthogonal to the deployment aspect because it discusses the application. Kubernetes and the fragile shell scripts are about the deployment of said application.

How are you going to deploy your C++ application? Both options are available, and I would wager that in most cases, Kubernetes makes more sense, unless you have strict requirements.

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#469

Post by tutfbhuf »

pwdisswordfish2 wrote: post #454
zelly wrote: post #394

Main benefits of Kubernetes: • Lets companies brag about having # many production services at any given time • Company saves money by not having to hire Linux sysadmins • Company saves money by not having to pay for managed cloud products if they don't want to • Declarative, version controlled, git-blameable deployments • Treating cloud providers like cattle not pets It's going to eat the world (already has?). I was…

I am ready! NetBSD is running on the toaster. I think haproxy can do 10K req/s. tcpserver on the backends. I only write robust shell scripts, short and portable. As a spectator, not a tech worker who uses these popular solutions, I would say there seems to be a great affinity amongst in the tech industry for anything that is (relatively) complex. Either that, or the only solutions people today can come up with are co…

I can see your point for small hobby projects. But enterprise web development in C++ is no fun at all. For example: "Google says that about 70% of all serious security bugs in the Chrome codebase are related to memory management and safety." https://www.zdnet.com/article/chrome-70-of-all-security-bugs...

Developer time for fixing these bugs is in most cases more expensive, than to throw more hardware at your software written in a garbage collected language.

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#470

Post by rocho »

pnako wrote: post #388
kronin wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like your setup lacks high availability. If you don't believe you need that, then yeah, kubernetes is overkill.

Few people actually need high availability. If you do, the recipe is to reduce the number of components, get the most reliable components you can find, and make the single points of failure redundant. Saying you can use Kubernetes to turn whatever stupid crap people tend to deploy with it highly available, is like saying you can make an airliner reliable by installing some sort of super fancy electronic box inside. Y…

What about application upgrades?

Are you ok with your application going down for each upgrade? With Kubernetes, it's very simple to configure a deployment so that downtime doesn't happen.

Post reply on HN