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China to inject $174B of liquidity on Monday as markets reopen

reuters.com

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Re: China to inject $174B of liquidity on Monday as markets reopen

#461

Post by ineedasername »

daenz wrote: post #425
bllguo wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, the vast majority of US citizens aren't getting brutalized by the police. Similarly, the vast majority of Chinese citizens are not being jailed or re-educated. You can't just compare the US population at large to the subset of Chinese people who speak out against the government. The claim was that people in China live in a state of fear, and I refuted it. Let's not conflate things.

>The claim was that people in China live in a state of fear, and I refuted it That wasn't the claim, so you refuted a strawman. The claim was that China governs through fear, not that Chinese live in fear. When people disappear and are "re-educated" against their will for speaking out about the government, as an official policy of your government , you are governing through fear. Refute that.

I refute it by pointing out that if the people are not afraid, they are not ruled by fear. The vast majority are no more afraid of their government than the average person in the U.S. is. Sure, some people have reason to fear-- there's the ever present problem of racial discrimination. And I don't mean this to say the U.S. is just as bad. I mean that people caught up in the badness in either country are outliers. So few in number as to make the issue seem too abstract, even if it is much worse in China. They just don't see their restrictions on freedoms through the same lens as folks in the Western world.

Re: China to inject $174B of liquidity on Monday as markets reopen

#462

Post by fouc »

Marsymars wrote: post #300
ulfw wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hm yea. Bagels aren't very popular in China. Or really outside the US.

Montreal would beg to differ.

Canada has good bagels. Safeway often sells amazing cheese halapeno bagels [0]

[0] https://s3-media0.fl.yelpcdn.com/bphoto/I9oFk8woGSbkQRIPXckL...

Re: China to inject $174B of liquidity on Monday as markets reopen

#463

Post by sillysaurusx »

ShorsHammer wrote: post #427

Meta: 185 top comment replies, 278 comments total. The redditfication of this place continues. China articles are essentially broken and there's no point trying to advance the discussion or have healthy debate. Someone should make an extension that collapses all replies and only shows top level comments, think it might be a lot healthier for online discourse.

You can help counter this effect by making thoughtful toplevel comments. They do get upvoted and seen.

It's not like Reddit. Your comment starts at the top, and falls after some time. Thoughtful content rises.

(Incidentally, messing with this formula is one reason why I was so vocal in the past.)

Re: China to inject $174B of liquidity on Monday as markets reopen

#464

Post by ra5 »

ShorsHammer wrote: post #427

Meta: 185 top comment replies, 278 comments total. The redditfication of this place continues. China articles are essentially broken and there's no point trying to advance the discussion or have healthy debate. Someone should make an extension that collapses all replies and only shows top level comments, think it might be a lot healthier for online discourse.

I’ve been suggesting the comment collapse idea for a while? Where can we put up a PR for this? Collapsing comments for HN’s comment scale is damn near required at this point.

Re: China to inject $174B of liquidity on Monday as markets reopen

#465

Post by nirav72 »

koheripbal wrote: post #435
yongjik wrote: post #429

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, about half of the comments are "(China/America/government in general) is evil, because (some superficial observation already known by 99% of visitors here and not directly relevant to the current situation)", or some form of generic refutation. I'm also frequently guilty of the same thing, but this is getting out of hand...

Social media websites all suffer from a phenomenon of being flooded low quality content the moment they become popular. Reddit's content quality dropped significantly the moment they deployed their mobile app, though it had been on a downward decline for a while. I've seen HN being discussed at length on Reddit as a better alternative for "adylts", but now we see the same slow decline here. The important questions ar…

the key to sanity while on Reddit is to stay on the non-default & topic/your area of interest specific subs.

Re: China to inject $174B of liquidity on Monday as markets reopen

#466

Post by ineedasername »

nate_meurer wrote: post #184
ineedasername wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe outside of China we see it as "ruled by fear", but that's really not the case in China, at least for the majority: China doesn't try to make it's citizens afraid. Quite the opposite. Their modus operandi is "move along, nothing to see here, everything is fine." Indeed, that was their initial message to the public for this virus. So, the problem and partial cause of panic is when there is a problem that is very…

Wouldn't a more accurate MO be "move along, nothing to see here, everything is fine, but if you speak out of turn we can make you disappear"?

They have a but more latitude than that. Grumble a bit and criticize, fine. Get too big and get too much attention, that's a problem. I understand they have a sort of warning system though, so it's not all "that dude said Jinping is a tyrant, get the black bags and duct tape!" I mean, it's bad, but not that bad. In part because by and large the government propoganda fulfills it's purpose.

Re: China to inject $174B of liquidity on Monday as markets reopen

#467

Post by germainelol »

Stevvo wrote: post #359
heymijo wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Speaking of Hong Kong, what impact is this outbreak having on the conflict with Beijing?

The protests died out as soon as the as outbreak started. Protesters avoid congregating to avoid transmission, and the news cycle has moved on. Carrie Lam must be breathing a sigh of relief.

Quite the opposite regarding Carrie Lam. There is a lot of anger towards the government over how they are handling the virus, specifically the insufficient mask supplies and not closing the border with China. Even the pro-Beijing supporters are angry with the government, and pro-Beijing parties are criticising the government in order to gain support in time for the September LegCo elections.

Re: China to inject $174B of liquidity on Monday as markets reopen

#468

Post by toasterlovin »

ra5 wrote: post #464
ShorsHammer wrote: post #427

Meta: 185 top comment replies, 278 comments total. The redditfication of this place continues. China articles are essentially broken and there's no point trying to advance the discussion or have healthy debate. Someone should make an extension that collapses all replies and only shows top level comments, think it might be a lot healthier for online discourse.

I’ve been suggesting the comment collapse idea for a while? Where can we put up a PR for this? Collapsing comments for HN’s comment scale is damn near required at this point.

FWIW, this site seems very well run to me. The mods seem to have very deeply considered positions on community management.

Re: China to inject $174B of liquidity on Monday as markets reopen

#469

Post by ineedasername »

celticmusic wrote: post #211
ineedasername wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe outside of China we see it as "ruled by fear", but that's really not the case in China, at least for the majority: China doesn't try to make it's citizens afraid. Quite the opposite. Their modus operandi is "move along, nothing to see here, everything is fine." Indeed, that was their initial message to the public for this virus. So, the problem and partial cause of panic is when there is a problem that is very…

> Indeed, that was their initial message to the public for this virus. You're going to have to source that because I have a friend who lives in China and he was telling me from the start that China was surprisingly open about all of it.

It appeared they were being pretty open about it, 10 days ago it was very "only a few hundred cases, and it doesn't spread easily from person to person." One first-hand account said they were telling people there hadn't been any new cases in a few days, so all was safe, go out and celebrate the new year. Now, they have the equivalent of double the population of Texas on lockdown.

It's also important to realize that the Chinese government isn't quite so monolithic and in lockstep with itself as you might think. It's entirely possible that in one smaller region the local government was being open, while the wider message was the "nothing to see." That's speculation though, just mentioning it as a way they could have been both open on one level and misleading on another.

Re: China to inject $174B of liquidity on Monday as markets reopen

#470

Post by daenz »

ineedasername wrote: post #461
daenz wrote: post #425

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The claim was that people in China live in a state of fear, and I refuted it That wasn't the claim, so you refuted a strawman. The claim was that China governs through fear, not that Chinese live in fear. When people disappear and are "re-educated" against their will for speaking out about the government, as an official policy of your government , you are governing through fear. Refute that.

I refute it by pointing out that if the people are not afraid, they are not ruled by fear. The vast majority are no more afraid of their government than the average person in the U.S. is. Sure, some people have reason to fear-- there's the ever present problem of racial discrimination. And I don't mean this to say the U.S. is just as bad. I mean that people caught up in the badness in either country are outliers. So…

If you can't watch this video[0] and see a level of fear in people to acknowledge the date June 4th 1989 on camera, then I just don't believe you are arguing in good faith. You seem to grossly underestimate what "disappearing" people for speaking out does to a society. You seem to think that Chinese citizens are ok with it, because they don't protest it, as if they are even allowed to speak out about it without serious repercussions. Just look at how HK reacted to the extradition laws. But I guess HK has become too westernized to understand that it's actually ok to disappear people.

0. https://vimeo.com/44078865

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