This discussion is missing context. The whole reason that Apple has to pay taxes on foreign income is because unlike almost every other developed nation the US has a worldwide tax system. Almost every other nation has a territorial tax system. The rest of the world with their territorial system taxes income earned within that country, the US rather taxes income worldwide, regardless of where it is earned. For example…
Apple plans new U.S. campus, to pay $38B in foreign cash taxes
461–470 of 537 posts
Re: Apple plans new U.S. campus, to pay $38B in foreign cash taxes
#462How realistic is it that a $5 billion fund can move a non-trivial amount of iPhone manufacturing to the US? Most of the BOM supply chain is in Asia, and assembly at FoxConn I heard amounts to 3% of the cost. It seems like Apple would have to build mostly automated assembly in the US or suffer severe margin reduction, and they'd suffer turnaround issues with the crucial components being still sourced in China. However…
”How realistic is it that a $5 billion fund can move a non-trivial amount of iPhone manufacturing to the US?” Neither the now-referenced page from Reuters nor Apple’s press release mention that. They will invest in their domestic suppliers and manufacturers, but that’s it, manufacturing-wise.
I think that when people hear that Apple has thousands of suppliers from 50 US states, people think that they're talking about high-tech suppliers for iPhones.
When in reality, Apple is also a retail chain operating in 45 states and has suppliers like cleaners and office suppliers and security that would naturally come locally. Not that these suppliers are worth less, but I don't think the reality matches what people think Apple is saying.
Re: Apple plans new U.S. campus, to pay $38B in foreign cash taxes
#463I'd like to know who those 9,000 American suppliers and manufacturers are. Other than Corning who supplies the Gorilla Glasses for almost all smartphone makers, I can't really name any significant domestic suppliers who would make up $55B of their "spending."
Re: Apple plans new U.S. campus, to pay $38B in foreign cash taxes
#464Earlier quoted context omitted.
If its stock buy backs, then why is Apple creating jobs and a new campus with the capital?
Apple has $238 billion in cash in it's bank accounts. It was able to do this even if the tax code didn't change.
Re: Apple plans new U.S. campus, to pay $38B in foreign cash taxes
#465Earlier quoted context omitted.
One of those "out" sides of the balance sheet is the owners of the corporation. That's generally who people think of when they think of who "pays" corporate tax. Especially for taxes on profits, which go 100% to the owners.
I agree that that’s what people seem to think. But if the corporate taxes get too high, wouldn’t you think that at some point, business owners start saying “screw it, I want to be a W-2 worker,” which obviously would put downward pressure on employee wages? Conversely, now that the tax reform bill created all these tax advantages for passthrough income, isn’t it obvious more people are going to be starting businesses…
Re: Apple plans new U.S. campus, to pay $38B in foreign cash taxes
#466Of course lowering taxes would encourage companies to repatriate large overseas cash hoards, but if that's the only goal, why have a tax at all? As a country the US has obligations to its current citizens and its future citizens and those obligations cost money. If we overly celebrate these windfalls every time the tax rate is lowered, we might not realize that what we owe the citizen is being forgot and allowed to e…
We currently get $0 in tax revenue from the cash Apple is hoarding overseas. This tax “holiday” (a term I dislike because it incorrectly implies that no tax is being paid on the repatriation, when it is simply a reduced rate) is resulting in $38 billion that we would not have otherwise received. $38,000,000,000 > $0
Re: Apple plans new U.S. campus, to pay $38B in foreign cash taxes
#467How realistic is it that a $5 billion fund can move a non-trivial amount of iPhone manufacturing to the US? Most of the BOM supply chain is in Asia, and assembly at FoxConn I heard amounts to 3% of the cost. It seems like Apple would have to build mostly automated assembly in the US or suffer severe margin reduction, and they'd suffer turnaround issues with the crucial components being still sourced in China. However…
Speak for yourself. I'm not at the high end of the income curve - not in the 1%, not even in the 10%, and I'm getting almost a $4k tax cut next year. I ran the numbers for my friends who are probably in the bottom half of the income curve (they make just over 40k between the two of them), and they're getting about a $1200 reduction. They were pretty shocked, since they'd been told over and over that it's not really a…
Secondly, let's dispense with this damned notion that the SALT deduction is somehow the high tax states benefiting at the expense of the low tax states, it is precisely the opposite. High tax states raise money and take better care of their citizens, and so their citizens consume less federal dollars per capita in need. In other words, state spending lowers the burden of the federal government having to pick up the slack. Isn't this the conservative dream? States rights? Spending decisions on social programs being done at the state level, laboratories of democracy and all that?
The low tax states, primarily RED STATES, do not spend sufficiently on their populations and as a result, are a larger burden on the federal government, requiring more subsidy. It is the low state states that are raising the cost of government for everyone else and it's quite ludicrous to claim states like CA and NY are being subsidized by this.
Most high tax blue states give more money to the federal government than they receive, and most of the low tax red states are a net federal burden.
So not only do California and New York already subsidize and pay for benefits that these low tax states aren't providing for their citizens, in addition to taking care of their own residents, their citizens now have to pay for egregious tax cuts and have a further burden thrust on them.
If you think the SALT deduction is California and New York benefiting at the expense of the red states, how about we impose a new rule that says your state cannot receive more federal dollars than it pays to the treasury,except in natural disasters and emergencies. Then let's see how long your low tax status lasts. Only a few of the low tax red states are net contributors.
The position that local governments shouldn't raise taxes to pay for their own programs is a deliberate attack on the whole concept of local control, states rights, and a smaller federal government. If states are not handling their people's needs, it just means the Federal government will be bigger and more invasive.
My question is, why do I have to pay for and subsidize the lack of government in these low tax, freeloader states? I mean, this is a rhetorical question, these are my fellow American citizens and the rich states should help the poor ones. But do you see how this faux GOP messaging about blue states could be turned around? I don't mind that my state is a net giver, but I'm really angry about claims we're takers and need to pay more. If you need more, maybe we'll pay more, but don't try an ideological wealth transfer from blue states to red states to appease your voting block and then turn around and lie about the reasons for these cuts. If you want to close my SALT deduction to pay for much needed middle class relief, infrastructure, or services, I'm all for it. But eliminate it so you can give the top 1% an enormous marginal tax break, or give a handful of ultrawealthy dynastic families an estate tax break? Hell no.
Secondly, the GOP tax plan isn't about you. They passed permanent budget busting tax cuts for corporations, for wealthy estates, didn't touch the carried interest loophole, and gave marginal tax cuts that will expire for you in a few years. They tried to eliminate deductability of tuition expenses for kids, for teachers, for medical expenses, and a host of other mostly middle class deductions, while adding loopholes for wealthy prep-school tuition. They hit the endowments of private colleges like Stanford, Harvard, etc with an endowment tax, while trying to exclude religious conservative degree mills. This think is a damn ideological sham with blatant attempts to punish democratically leaning states and institutions that aren't even veiled, and sold as what every knows is a sham, with the new budget deficits providing the justification needed to gut entitlements.
I expect I'll be voted down, but my state has high taxes because we like having a top university system, we like taking care of our people, and we like cleaning up our environment. Maybe these other states don't, that's for their voters to decide, it is the right of Californians to spend more of their own money to take of their people instead of asking the Feds to do it.
Re: Apple plans new U.S. campus, to pay $38B in foreign cash taxes
#468Earlier quoted context omitted.
But of course Apple isn't paying no German taxes. They didn't pay taxes on any of this overseas money, and they had the gall to ask for an "repatriation holiday" so they could pay overall zero taxes on that huge heap of money. Now they are paying the US gov. Unless they can keep coming up with more Irish tax avoidance schemes, going forward they will probably also have to pay in Europe.
Yes, they paid taxes in Germany, France, etc. it’s reported in their financial statements. They’ve already paid 8 or 9% foreign income taxes on their foreign earnings.
Re: Apple plans new U.S. campus, to pay $38B in foreign cash taxes
#469Earlier quoted context omitted.
Apple has $238 billion in cash in it's bank accounts. It was able to do this even if the tax code didn't change.
Did it have $238B domestically? The topic is about Apple being able to bring their cash horde back to the US, where they can then use it.
Apple has already been doing buybacks and dividends by using bonds.
Re: Apple plans new U.S. campus, to pay $38B in foreign cash taxes
#470This discussion is missing context. The whole reason that Apple has to pay taxes on foreign income is because unlike almost every other developed nation the US has a worldwide tax system. Almost every other nation has a territorial tax system. The rest of the world with their territorial system taxes income earned within that country, the US rather taxes income worldwide, regardless of where it is earned. For example…
Wait a minute. Does this tax bill end the situation where e.g. Google earns $100 million/year in my European home country, but pay only $150,000 in taxes to my home country, using an Irish holding company to ensure their net tax rate (including to the US) on this amount is only a few percent? That would seem like a very good thing to me. The current situation is quite unjust.