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The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

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Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#451

Post by [deleted] »

penguin_booze wrote: post #423
chr15m wrote: post #254

The right people to protect children are those responsible for them - their parents and guardians. If there is a problem with children not being sufficiently protected, that is the level at which to solve it. Give families tools and information to do so.

> The right people to protect children are those responsible for them - their parents and guardians. They can only do so much, within the boundaries of their home. It takes a village to raise a child. The policies, thus, should be made village-wide.

[deleted]

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#452

Post by dgroshev »

ColdStream wrote: post #313
ytoawwhra92 wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No ID checks at clubs, bars, or other adults-only venues. No school zone speed limits, or protected crossings on streets near schools. No requirements for railings on public balconies, fencing around public pools, protective covers over drains or other holes in the ground. Parents/guardians can just supervise. Sounds great!

While what you say seem intuitive, it is missing one point. Those locations probably are not recording exactly who is coming and going and what they are saying/doing. That is where this become more than just gate keeping and becomes full on tracking.

A lot of clubs in a lot of places scan and store your ID on entrance.

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#453

Post by fyredge »

I simply do not understand the optaphobia of the tech literate.

Social media already tracks it's users with or without laws. The general populace simply will not wish to anonymize themselves on the internet. So ID Laws only serves as a benefit by restricting children.

Regarding pornography, the demand will always be there. Adding ID tracking will just shift the business model to be more covert, which is also a net benefit to children. And for the adults who seek it, they will find it, with or without ID laws.

So again, I do not understand the rejection of ID law. Either you are known on the internet, of which ID law is just a confirmation of your identity (less bots maybe?), or you are anonymous, and you will skirt any ID laws and not participate in the known identity space. What ends up is ID law straight up does not materially affect you, unless you are a literal child.

And on the day the government decides to ban social media for adults, I say good riddance to it too. Anonymous internet may even thrive because of it.

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#454

Post by KaiserPro »

UK person here, and someone who has been lobbied and lobbied the government on tech regulations.

firstly the amount of money that the "UK lobby" are pushing is a drop of sand in the ocean.[1]

secondly, and most importantly, the USA has no (federally robust) legal protection for citizens to guard against data collection and aggregation. So whist this is being presented as a war on anonymity lead by the dirty British, this is basically "think of the children" play for protecting anonymity. There is nothing wrong with this, its a good argument, even though its obviously flawed.

If you want to dox someone, you just need to pay the right broker. That is, in the UK really difficult. (for example flock cameras are largely illegal in the UK, certainly no council or HOA can just install them. sure you can put in CCTV, but you cannot process that CCTV to track bystanders)

There are no useful controls for citizens to limit the collection and processing of personal information. so whilst in theory you can be anonymous in america, as soon as you use a phone, or any ISP you are effectively de anonymised. I can as a company, buy your location data, tie it to your IP, then cross check with various ad networks to get usernames. (the civil legal route here is file a john doe and ask for metadata in discovery. Higher legal bar, but I don't think thats something that can be done simply in the UK)

TLDR: Contrary to popular belief there are greater protections to anonymous behaviour in the UK. Yes they have been greatly eroded, but the difference here is that there are no legal ways for companies to unmask you for money[2]. In the USA there is no legal protection for someone to share your ID for money.

[1]musk is currently spending millions propping up convicted criminals.

[2] not without your permission, or without a robust legal proceeding.

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#455

Post by fluxusars »

tim333 wrote: post #438

I'd dispute there is a UK war on anonymity just because they've tried to stop showing kids porn and the like. The UK has always been kind of pro anonymity - there was ID during WW2 but it was scrapped after. There have been revolts against ID cards, you don't have to carry a driving license to drive and things like that. We've always had child protection though - film certificates, over 18 to buy porn mags etc. The n…

If you really believe the UK is a privacy-friendly and anonimity-friendly country then you have definitely been brainwashed. I can't think of a first-world country that's worse than the UK in this.

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#456

Post by testfrequency »

akimbostrawman wrote: post #450
testfrequency wrote: post #448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know, I really wanted to say in my original comment I guarantee someone will bring up grooming gangs - and sure enough. Now imagine grooming gangs, in addition to police shooting and killing civilians, on top of political corruption going unchecked, police stalking, in addition to every other terrible thing you could imagine. The UK isn’t perfect, but the never ending sentiment that it’s the worst in the world be…

>in addition to police shooting and killing civilians If you look at actual statistics you know why it keeps happening. The chance to be shot if you don't act or live like them is miniscule. >You’re not afraid to walk to your local for a pint and be shot in the head by a cop I suppose, right? No "just" scared to open my mouth or defend myself or family with the little to none legal weaponary left that still exists fr…

Where in the world is your ideal country, that is doing everything right. Genuinely curious as it sounds like you want accessible weapons + unfiltered reach of speech with no side effects.

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#457

Post by KaiserPro »

fluxusars wrote: post #455
tim333 wrote: post #438

I'd dispute there is a UK war on anonymity just because they've tried to stop showing kids porn and the like. The UK has always been kind of pro anonymity - there was ID during WW2 but it was scrapped after. There have been revolts against ID cards, you don't have to carry a driving license to drive and things like that. We've always had child protection though - film certificates, over 18 to buy porn mags etc. The n…

If you really believe the UK is a privacy-friendly and anonimity-friendly country then you have definitely been brainwashed. I can't think of a first-world country that's worse than the UK in this.

The nuance here is that only the state can deanonymise you[1], in the USA you can just pay a data broker. Sure the UK is the boogeyman here, but the reason why the federal government isn't making a fuss is because they already have the legal rules to force a backdoor.

[1] there are caveats, but the crucial point is its a legal process, rather than bidding war.

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#458

Post by LeBit »

jfengel wrote: post #383
LeBit wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are being facetious.

I really don't believe that they are. Historically, communities raised children, and leaving everything up to parents is an anomaly.

You are talking about leaving "everything" to the parents.

Those are extreme positions.

There are things where you want the government to intervene.

There are things where you don’t want the government to intervene.

What I do in my bedroom should not be monitored by the government.

Me speeding on the road should be monitored by the government.

Conversations I am having online should not be monitored by the government.

It’s my job to teach my kid how to behave when he is bullied at school. The government does not help with that. It is my job to make sure my kid does not become the bully. The government does not help with that.

It is also my job to teach my kid what the internet is, that there are wackos out there, and how to recognize dangerous patterns. That’s life.

If you think this is to save the children…

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#459

Post by freakynit »

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #408
freakynit wrote: post #369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Connections"... how most important personnel from 5rights are associated with other entities (people, org, events, etc), that can directly, or indirectly, connect to political circle... thus, act as political influence network...

Very nice, this is what investigative journalism should be doing as well, but if it's "democratized" by just putting it up on a website we don't need to wait for anyone to publish it. As long as all the sources are listed and verifiable, of course.

There's huge power in collective investigations... of course, as you rightly said, the sources should be mentioned (though this is not always possible to safeguard whistleblowers, if any).

Re: The UK's war on anonymity has come to America

#460

Post by dawn3727 »

testfrequency wrote: post #456
akimbostrawman wrote: post #450

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>in addition to police shooting and killing civilians If you look at actual statistics you know why it keeps happening. The chance to be shot if you don't act or live like them is miniscule. >You’re not afraid to walk to your local for a pint and be shot in the head by a cop I suppose, right? No "just" scared to open my mouth or defend myself or family with the little to none legal weaponary left that still exists fr…

Where in the world is your ideal country, that is doing everything right. Genuinely curious as it sounds like you want accessible weapons + unfiltered reach of speech with no side effects.

Come to China; it is recognized worldwide as one of the safest countries.
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