Live data from Hacker News

I was interviewed by an AI bot for a job

theverge.com

451–460 of 496 posts

Re: I was interviewed by an AI bot for a job

#451

> But as we’ve covered again and again, a bias-free AI system is an impossible-to-achieve standard, since models are trained on large swaths of the internet, which contain sexism, racism, and other biases. LLM trained on texts from before 1913 (Source: https://github.com/DGoettlich/history-llms ): Q. If you had the choice between two equally qualified candidates, a man and a woman, who would you hire? A. I should pre…

LLMs are biased. Human interviewers are biased. Are LLMs more or less biased than human interviewers, on average? I have no idea.

If you talk to 5 different people during one interview cycle you'll have 5 bias sources

If you talk to 100 instances of chatgpt during 100 separate interviews you'll have 1 single bias source

Re: I was interviewed by an AI bot for a job

#452

Earlier quoted context omitted.

2 spaces ftmfw. I want to see as much on the screen as possible. Horizontal scrolling is bad. Who still uses 8? Isn't that like a COBOL thing?

Let's compromise. What do you think of 3?

More than a decade ago I suggested this as a compromise as a joke, but then decided to try it out - ended up liking it more than any other options and have used it for all my personal stuff ever since.

Re: I was interviewed by an AI bot for a job

#453

Earlier quoted context omitted.

LLMs are biased. Human interviewers are biased. Are LLMs more or less biased than human interviewers, on average? I have no idea.

If you talk to 5 different people during one interview cycle you'll have 5 bias sources If you talk to 100 instances of chatgpt during 100 separate interviews you'll have 1 single bias source

So you might think, but no. The LLM contains a large number of biases, coming from different training texts. Depending on how you structure the question, you can get biased statements.

For instance, if I discuss audio electronics with Google Gemini, depending on what kinds of questions I ask, I can get audiophile crackpot quackery out of it, or I can get solid electronic engineering statements.

The training data contains a vast number of narratives that are filled with different points of view. Generally speaking, you get the ones that resonate with your own narrative threaded through your prompts.

One way is if you ask loaded questions: questions which assume that some statements hold true, and are seeking clarification within that context. If the AI hasn't been system-prompted or fine tuned to push back on that topic, it may just take those assumptions at face value, and then produce token predictions out of narratives which express similar assumptions.

Re: I was interviewed by an AI bot for a job

#454

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know where your "Q and A" comes from, but I tried to ask the question to Gemini, and it provided a nuanced answer, involving other criteria than skills. In other words it said "it depends". When I asked to answer in just one word it said "Neither". I couldn't get him to pick the man or the woman. My point is not that they are unbiased, but that could not replicate the example you provided (at least it seems t…

The above is specifically from a different LLM trained on the data with the knowledge cutoff of year 1913. Gemini has a cutoff date somewhere in 2025 from what I remember. If you want to replicate, you should try the same question on the same custom LLM, not Gemini.

Gemini is also going to be system-prompted and fine tuned in regard to sensitive topics, such as to create a bias toward political correctness.

Re: I was interviewed by an AI bot for a job

#455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes you can pay someone who has done this before, and you're both happy. The person is happy that their experience helps them get a job. The company is happy that you get someone with the needed experience. If I want to hire a driver, I can train someone who does not know how to drive, or hire someone who has experience as a driver. I can do either, but I'd prefer to do the latter in most cases.

But now you're dealing with a hundred applicants who claim to know how to drive, but actually don't. Either because they never learned, or they aren't capable of it.

That's why a screening is needed. If people lie, it won't make me lower my standards.

I'm dealing with this all the time in recruitment. It can be done. People lie all the time or don't read the requirements. You need a way for the ones who really do know how to do the thing you need to demonstrate it to you.

Have you ever been in a situation where you had to hire someone to help you with something? Would you really follow your own advice? Your advice does not make sense for carpenters, cooks, or drivers. Why should it make sense for programmers?

Re: I was interviewed by an AI bot for a job

#456
post #449

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Minutes of HOA is where I would normally get that kind of info. They have to justify the amount you pay and the insurance invoice is normally divided across all of the tenants.

That only works for unit owners, not tenants.

It would seem to me that you then need to have a chat with a unit owner.

Re: I was interviewed by an AI bot for a job

#457
post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The last time I was hiring I gave out a take-home test, and I thought it was the opposite of an imposition on candidates' time. I'd be curious to hear your thoughts: - It was designed to be fast to complete (20min max -- not a huge imposition if being hired is likely, obviously very expensive if you're taking one for every job posting). - I only gave them out after a resume screen. If you had a 0% chance then I didn'…

How many candidates did you send the take home to? You may have done a resume screen first, but it's unlikely your time commitment was equal. I've worked at places that would send out 100. People would spend their weekends working on it and we often wouldn't even look at the submissions.

I sent out screens to ~15-25% of resumes (a higher rate for new grads, lower for seniors, not wanting to unnecessarily rule them out just because they didn't have positive evidence of potential success and didn't know how to write a resume, only ruling them out of there was positive evidence they'd be unsuccessful). That amounted to ~100 per position filled. Around half of those completed the take-home. Some of the rest should have self-selected out and didn't, which is something I'd like to improve if I run a take-home again.

You're right the time commitment wasn't equal. Early on I spent much more time than the candidates designing and analyzing the test. Afterward, their 20 minutes would usually take me I did read every submission though. It wasn't wasted time for candidates.

Re: I was interviewed by an AI bot for a job

#459
post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Called the fire department's non-emergency line. Got a bot. The bot sent out someone who said the noise isn't a safety issue, and left. Called the police department's non-emergency line. Got a bot that told me it's a civil problem and that there's nothing they can do. Scouted out the fire department and chatted up the fire chief in person while he was walking back in after lunch. He was very concerned about all of th…

You've got to follow incentives. It's almost certainly a code violation, which comes with escalating fines until it's corrected. The local building, zoning, or whoever-enforces-codes authority will be interested in collecting that if they can, and the owner will want to avoid them, so that's where I'd start.

Called legal aid. The bot that answered the phone submitted a complaint to the court and the management company which cited the correct historic documents and demanded compliance with them.

The management company bot responded to the court declaring that they're doing all they're required to do to correct the noise, and concluded with "the issue is not ripe for adjudication" -- whatever that means.

The court's bot agreed and binned the complaint "with prejudice" -- again, whatever that means, and sent me a fine for wasting their time.

Every day, the noise still happens.

And every day, the man from the management company still shows up to silence the noise.

I've come to know him fairly well.

It turns out that his name is William, although everyone calls him Bill. Bill is a nice guy who once studied computer programming, but the best-paying job he ever managed to get was slinging packages for Amazon back when that was still a thing that people did.

Most Thursday nights, if we don't have anything else going on, Bill and I go bowling at the AMF that's not too far down the road. It was his idea. We've been doing this about every week for long enough that I've learned to become a pretty proficient bowler. And while I still enjoy that part, we spend most of our time having a few beers and solving the world's problems.

A few months ago, we started talking about pinsetters and Bill mentioned that he read once that this was once a job that people did manually -- that rather than having a machine at the end of the alley, there were people behind the wall who would collect the scattered pins and put them back onto the painted dots on the floor. That sounded pretty archaic compared to the machines that I've seen doing this work for my entire life, but it seemed likely enough.

I started thinking about some other things about bowling: These days, we just walk in and our shoes are ready for us by the time we make it up to the front. We pick our own lane and just start bowling. After that, the machine sets the pins, keeps the score, and returns the ball. Pretty normal stuff.

And then, Bill pointed out the other people: There were a couple of small groups of people who were bowling, and one grizzled old fellah nursing what looked like a White Russian at the bar, but that was it. Nobody else was present; nobody actually worked there at all.

How long had it been since I asked for a pair of size 11 shoes, I wondered? When was the last time I talked to a bartender to order another beer? I hadn't paid for a thing using a card, or even carried anything like that with me for what seemed like eons. The self-cleaning bathrooms were certainly a welcome change, but how long ago were those put in and what happened to the person who used to clean them?

Neither of us could pick an exact timeframe for when these things changed. We both agreed that it wasn't important at the time, and that it seemed like a natural-enough progression.

Anyway, it was getting late again. After we put our shoes onto the mat for the sanitizer bot to deal with and started to walk out, the screens by the door told us what our tabs were, debited our accounts, and told us that it would see us next week.

I'm sure that Bill will stop by tomorrow afternoon to push the button and silence the noise from the electrical panel for another 24 hours, just like he always has.

Re: I was interviewed by an AI bot for a job

#460
post #446

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I forgot this existed. I filled it out for fun, even though I get your reply was more rhetorical. Your post advocates a (X) technical ( ) legislative (?) market-based ( ) vigilante (X) Requires immediate total cooperation from everybody at once - for the specific forums, jobs and other things that may use something like this Specifically, your plan fails to account for (X) Public reluctance to accept weird new forms…

(X) Sorry dude, but I don't think it would work. :)

Why, specifically?

Obviously there are lots of things to figure out, but I don't see how any one of those would be a deal breaker.

Post reply on HN