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In Europe, wind and solar overtake fossil fuels

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Re: In Europe, wind and solar overtake fossil fuels

#451

Post by bryanlarsen »

testing22321 wrote: post #4

Solar prices in the US are criminal, protecting oil and gas who bought all the politicians. Canada here. 7.6kw on our roof for $0 out of pocket thanks to $5k grant and $8k interest free loan. It makes 7.72Mwh per year, worth $1000. Tight valley, tons of snow. We put that on the loan for 8 years, then get $1000 per year free money for 20 years or so. Biggest no brainer of all time. Dad in Victoria Australia just got 1…

Figure out what you can do without a permit or inspections in your jurisdiction.

For example, in my jurisdiction it's: That's not a lot, but my primary purpose is as a generator replacement -- keep my fridge powered during a summer power outage or my furnace fan powered during a winter one. The other 364 days of the year it just slowly pays for itself.

Panels, battery, wiring and paying a roofer to install the flashings for the mounts all cost under $3000. A single one of the required inspections would have cost about that much.

Re: In Europe, wind and solar overtake fossil fuels

#452

Post by KaiserPro »

doublerabbit wrote: post #73
mekdoonggi wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not? You've got abundant wind and solar. Once installed, even if for some reason you can't get new turbines or panels, you'll still have a decent amount of capacity.

Solar is hit & miss. The only capacity we really have is wind and those are only efficient to those near the sea or in the highlands. England, Scotland, Wales are governed by rain 80% of the year and with the sun we get, household solar rarely breaks even. Just because we've got, if the government isn't supporting it's pretty much wasted. The renewable farms we do have are mostly funded by private investments firms.…

> household solar rarely breaks even.

mate, I dunno what your smoking, but it deffo does. I'm about 50% "paid off" and I had an expensive setup. Installed now the equivalent costs about 50% of what it did.

> Scotland and Wales wants more renewable but the UK government says no.

National grid say "holy shit I need to build more cables" then local people say "ewwww pylons" and shit gets more expensive. There is a bottleneck between england and scotland, which is partially being solved by https://www.nationalgrid.com/the-great-grid-upgrade

The whole boo england, poor scotland/wales thing gets tired super quick. its being solved, is it being solved fast enough? no, but thats because we have a raised a shit generation of empty politicians from across UK and NI. (and the co-dependent pundit class)

> The renewable farms we do have are mostly funded by private investments firms.

Mostly pension funds. but yes, private. However given the high turnover of (useless) polticians, and a civil service that has had all is expertise hollowed out and replaced by consultancy firms, I don't think public funding, without structural reform is a good idea (look at railways for example)

Re: In Europe, wind and solar overtake fossil fuels

#453

Post by azornathogron »

buckle8017 wrote: post #378

I'm extremely skeptical of that graph because it has zero seasonal variation. Solar performs dramatically worse in the winter than in summer.

The graph I see in the article displays a single data point per year. You're not going to see seasonal variation in a graph with that resolution. Is there another graph that I missed?

Re: In Europe, wind and solar overtake fossil fuels

#454

Post by testing22321 »

foobarian wrote: post #440
testing22321 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The price of panels is falling so fast I don’t think anyone truly understands. I paid nearly double that for our 450w panels 18 months ago.

People keep saying that prices of panels keep falling, and yet any time I look at getting panels on my roof the price is the same $3/W it has been for 10 years already.

Buying the panels yourself, or an install company supplying them?

What country?

In 10 years the price has fallen dramatically, you’re getting majorly ripped off.

Re: In Europe, wind and solar overtake fossil fuels

#455

Post by boringg »

testing22321 wrote: post #392
boringg wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Talking about hard numbers without a real "hard number" in your comment. 0$ upfront - how much did you pay for the system / what is the size of the system / whats your azimuth and what are you paying for electricity currently. Its super easy to run the math on this stuff - not rocket science - theres even a free to use API that generates your monthly production estimates. I run energy modeling - I ran the numbers las…

The numbers are in my original post. We got 7.6kw installed for $13,000 CAD. I ordered everything myself, had a local installer do it on his weekend, paid an electrician $180 to pull permits and actually wire it into the main house panel. All inspections complete and legal. $5000 grant $8000 interest free loan. The system makes 7.76Mwh per calendar year. Electricity here is 0.13/kwh, and already pre-approved go up mi…

Those numbers are pretty low for Canada (well done on getting a good deal) - though it sounds like you are doing all the work yourself so thats sweat equity and the difference is the margins / work that installers put into the equation.

I don't think what you are providing as an example is what most people are doing. Most people are going through residential installers and not doing all the effort you did to bring down costs.

I commend your effort but it isn't what most people would be doing or paying for and represent otherwise isn't quite honest for people looking to get numbers for their own install.

Re: In Europe, wind and solar overtake fossil fuels

#456

Post by thinkcontext »

sp4cec0wb0y wrote: post #136

Imagine the powerhouse America would be (pun intended) if we subsidized nuclear energy to become the defacto producer of nuclear power plants world wide. Sometimes it is easier said than done but this really is as easy as said.

The US gave the nuclear industry a chance for a nuclear renaissance with the subsidies they asked for towards the AP1000. The industry whiffed big time. Looks like nuclear will get another chance with the increased subsidies begun under Biden, the deregulatory approach of Trump and the huge demand spike in electricity. Its an open question on whether they'll be able to deliver.

Re: In Europe, wind and solar overtake fossil fuels

#457

Post by thinkcontext »

Moldoteck wrote: post #290
mrks_hy wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have it backwards. At the current cost curve for renewables and storage, Nuclear will never again be able to compete. See: the overly optimistic SMR plans being predictably scrapped in many places. What you do have is ample land to build out solar and export eg. Ammonia (made out of Hydrogen) for "free" energy.

nuclear can compete if we re-learn to build on time and on budget. Japanese abwr did cost 3bn and done in <4y. China does the same now for cheaper. There's no such thing as free hydrogen, nor it will be

Even in China the case for nuclear isn't overwhelming. They are building a lot of nuclear relative to the rest of the world but its not that much compared to how much wind and solar they are deploying.

Re: In Europe, wind and solar overtake fossil fuels

#459

Post by daveguy »

vjvjvjvjghv wrote: post #434
daveguy wrote: post #369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Republicans are always trying to increase and protect oil subsidizes, cheer "drill baby drill", and have social media tools peddling their bs who are funded by foreign influence campaigns. The Democats may not be perfect, but they are much more likely to cut oil subsidies or at least subsidize solar and other renewables to balance. This is especially true as the next generation takes over by primarying the tepid foss…

Fly over Texas and the California and compare the number of solar and wind installations you see.

Yup. 46.8 GW photovoltaic in California and 22.8 GW photovoltaic in Texas. Over twice as much PV in California even though they have higher standards for new construction in general than Texas does.

Re: In Europe, wind and solar overtake fossil fuels

#460

Post by filloooo »

mekdoonggi wrote: post #2

Curious if this will eventually change China's calculus with regards to Russia. If Europe is a big customer for Chinese exports, and Russia is antagonizing, it seems like China would have an incentive to put pressure on Russia. It already seems like Russia is positioned to be completely subservient to China in the future.

Your geopolitical views are so naive it's hard to take seriously.

EU is now an unwilling dumping ground for China, hostility and paranoia are growing by the day now that China is no longer a lucrative market itself and is pursuing its interests outside commerce, the cordial days are numbered.

Russia would never be subservient to China, once the war ends Russia would be back being a geopolitical player because of its vast natural resources, and they are already import substituting even Chinese products.

Russia can turn to the west to be a real western country whenever they see fit, the eternal fear for China.

This is why China is going as far as it can to accommodate Putin, even souring it's relations with the EU which isolated itself.

In this sense, it is China being "subservient" to Russia.

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