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Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

thehill.com

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Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#451

Post by jupblb »

jakub_g wrote: post #449
cj wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For those curious, a common method is to publish the job listing in the newspaper classifieds. This is what my old employer did to sponsor the visa for the company’s CTO. Newspapers are used for a surprising number of various public announcements. E.g. in New York you must publish a notice in a newspaper for 6 weeks (or something like that) when establishing a LLC. There’s something to be said for reading the paper e…

In Poland a while ago, a basketball club submitted an opening to local labor office, looking for "basketball player with 5 years of NBA experience". Update: source: https://radioszczecin-pl.translate.goog/1,116784,koszykarze-...

Please share a link to source

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#452

Post by bregma »

overfeed wrote: post #313
lumost wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s interesting that the U.S. picked an employer-driven model, which effectively outsources immigration selection to firms. That’s efficient for demand-matching, but it concentrates bargaining power in ways that a points-based model avoids. The practical effect of an H1-B is to act as a non-compete, punitive termination clause, and a time bounded employment contract. These are very expensive terms to ask for in conv…

> It’s interesting that the U.S. picked an employer-driven model... Health insurance, parental leave† and retirement are also employer-driven. This seems to be a US default that incidentally gives a lot of leverage to employers. † Yes there are government mandated minimums, but when compared to other developed countries, substantive parental leave is largely left to the generosity of the employer

You wrote "incidentally" but I think you meant "intentionally". There is no evidence it's a coincidence, but there is a great deal of evidence that it is not.

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#453

Post by IshKebab »

tha_hnrain wrote: post #443

Let me play the devil advocate here: - first, I don’t think the measures they put in place are unreasonable: publishing on newspapers, mailing your application instead of emailing or using online forms may feel outdated, but they are all standard practice in other countries. You cannot say you don’t know how to mail(!) or that reading newspapers is beneath your dignity, especially if you need a job! -second, what is…

> intentionally barring foreign talent to artificially inflate wages for domestic workers undermines U.S. competitiveness

Sure, but the Americans here don't really care about American competitiveness - they care about their inflated wages! The biggest thing they fear is that American wages will become more in line with the rest of the world.

And to be fair, the American tech industry is still doing pretty well in spite of the enormous wages. Probably because America is such a friendly environment for startups.

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#454

Post by Amezarak »

hvb2 wrote: post #445
zjaffee wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except this isn't about H1B this is about the PERM process for EB2/EB3 greencards. The truth is we should be much more open to temporary work permits, and much less open to this sort of thing for granting permanent residency. Tons of people getting employment based green cards hold jobs that could easily be filled by an American.

> Tons of people getting employment based green cards hold jobs that could easily be filled by an American. Could be filled by an American, sure. Is the American willing to do the work? Probably not... This is not a uniquely American problem. In tech, I've always felt it was hard to hire Americans because it seems there's such a push for degrees in business/law etcetera as opposed to engineering.

How hard are you looking? I was looking early last year and despite hundreds of applications, got nothing but automated rejection emails, if that.

I also know many new grads looking for jobs and having a lot of trouble.

Unfortunately, their experience is telling their younger peers not to go into tech - it's full.

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#455

Post by nerpderp82 »

bregma wrote: post #452
overfeed wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It’s interesting that the U.S. picked an employer-driven model... Health insurance, parental leave† and retirement are also employer-driven. This seems to be a US default that incidentally gives a lot of leverage to employers. † Yes there are government mandated minimums, but when compared to other developed countries, substantive parental leave is largely left to the generosity of the employer

You wrote "incidentally" but I think you meant "intentionally". There is no evidence it's a coincidence, but there is a great deal of evidence that it is not.

This drives a lot of the opposition to single payer insurance from the corporate world. They lose leverage as it would increase wages and labor mobility.

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#456

Post by dotnet00 »

austhrow743 wrote: post #286
AuthError wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this also holds true for chemical, biomedical researchers, mechanical engineers working in deep tech, software engineering is such an anomaly that it's hard to do income based lottery without overindexing on swe market

What does overindexing on the swe market mean? If these other professions don’t pay as much as swe, then doesn’t that indicate that domestic supply is meeting those industries needs better than it is swe?

Not at all. Salaries aren't just a function of talent availability, they're also a function of capital availability.

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#457

Post by bitshiftfaced »

nova22033 wrote: post #138
bitshiftfaced wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not the only way you can work in the US. "In 2023 17.9% of employed workers were immigrants" https://usafacts.org/answers/what-percent-of-jobs-in-the-us-...

From your link Immigrants are defined as foreign-born residents, including those who became US citizens

The real number is probably somewhere between 1% and 17.9%, since you need to include all other ways to work in the US, including the various visas.

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#458

Post by wccrawford »

legitster wrote: post #172

So I was at a company that did this a lot - it was much less nefarious than on the surface. It was usually related to them recruiting a certain specialist or acquiring a team at another company. But the only way to get these people visas was to post the jobs publicly and hide them as much as possible. They did this by the hundreds, and it wasn't really a cost saving measure - if you are trying to get anybody in parti…

It's still picking someone for the job when there might be other qualified workers who are fit for the job, but you're not even giving them a chance.

The whole point of the system is that you shouldn't do this, and you legally can't.

So it really is as nefarious as it seems.

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#459

Post by m-schuetz »

Taek wrote: post #250
thephyber wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This conflates high education specialists with high earnings. It’s probably not completely uncorrelated, but only giving H1-Bs to the highest paying reqs which need them starves all of the other reqs of any possible candidates. I understand that H1-Bs are currently likely to create an abusive relationship with the visa-ed employee, but just because you have identified a valid diagnosis doesn’t mean your suggested pre…

That seems like a fair way for the free market to address things, no? If you need special carve outs, create a new type of Visa for those special cases. The immigrants are all going to be paying taxes on their earnings. If you can boost H1B salaries by an average of $20k/yr by doing a price auction, that brings govt revenue and maybe even gives opportunities to balance the budget by creating more H1B slots.

I don't think it's that fair. IT jobs are exceptionally well paid and this system may starve other domains of talent, domains that don't have that kind of fuck-it money that IT has.

But I agree rhat H1B should not be about hiring cheap labour. I'd prefer a system where H1B salaries must be competitive with the top of the field. There are incredibly smart talents around the world, and if you hire someone from outside then it should be because they are the best of the best, so they should get paid accordingly.

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#460

Post by jalapenos »

1024core wrote: post #202

A lot of these problems could be solved if H1-B's were given out in order of salary (I think there's such a proposal going around recently). And by that I mean: something like a Dutch auction. Give H1-Bs to the top 85K paying jobs (maybe normalized to SoL in the region, I'm sure the BLS has some idea on how to do it). The lure of H1-Bs is the money savings, and the fact that if you're on an H1-B, you're practically a…

This is an absolutely perfect and extremely simple solution.

But people would have to implement it. Sorry.

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