Live data from Hacker News

iPhone Air

apple.com

451–460 of 1001 posts

Re: iPhone Air

#451
post #167

"Impossibly thin" is right in line with Patrick McGee's "Apple in China" who argues that the main reason for Apple's designs is to keep imitators at bay by introducing manufacturing challenges that only they can meet. Indeed impossible at the time of release. One generation after the other. He estimates this gains them about 6 months of headway. Tough world. (Yes, to be fair, there is more to this new phone than just…

What’s the evidence for which way causality works? Apple solving design problems they care about would inevitably involve solutions only viable at their scale. It’s hard to say whether that’s how they choose their design problems. Their process seems pretty similar to their approach with unibody MacBooks or the original MacBook Air, both of which were introduced long before imitators were their primary competition.

> What’s the evidence for which way causality works?

One qualifier would be "at scale and profitably."

But for more detail, yes, the situation has changed over time and probably the reasoning has changed over time.

McGee spends a lot of time on the difficulty for Apple R&D to keep up with Apple design bureau's demands. To the point that Apple execs arrive at decisions that for the sake of internal peace and meeting deadlines, Apple Industrial Design is not to make arbitrary demands (like they used to) and must consider manufacturing realities. Which still leaves Manufacturing struggling at every step to keep up. So - usually - manufacturing is very much pushed to the edge of what's possible by Design. Even though Apple teach China phone manufacturing (again "at scale and profitably"). Design are the ones pushing. Whether Design is really concerned with keeping ahead of competitors... is not explicitely told by Apple people. They do seem to love "impossible". In my recollection, it's more McGee's observations and conclusion.

Apple mainland China companies competition has also been a widely varying quantity. In part due to Chinese fashion trends and in part due to Apple political difficulties in China (which come and go). Underlying should be "at scale and profitably": Apple rightly shouldn't care if a few exotic phones come out. That wouldn't matter to their bottom line. They are described as caring when there is a flood of matching phones coming out - and even then with some latency.

Overall btw, "Apple in China" is fantastic. With massive amounts of local color and "story viewed from the Apple China people's side". Lots of bits that were missed if you mostly followed Apple from the side of what we see in the US.

Re: iPhone Air

#453
post #187

Can someone that is actually interested in this explain the appeal? Thin on its own I get but thin with a giant bump 100% defeats the whole point for me. Seems clear at this point there is little hope of them engineering their way into thin cameras.

Optics is not going to be "solved" by anything but some fascinating kind of metamaterial.

iPhone 4S has camera without bump and makes perfect photos. I don't understand why they are doing that ugly design.

Re: iPhone Air

#454
post #187

Can someone that is actually interested in this explain the appeal? Thin on its own I get but thin with a giant bump 100% defeats the whole point for me. Seems clear at this point there is little hope of them engineering their way into thin cameras.

iPhone status symbol without having to haul around a huge bulky phone. Most users probably use/need 10% of what a max pro iPhone offers, but they want 100% of the max pro status. Now they can keep the status without needing to carry a chonker.

iPhone hasnt been a status symbol in many years. Its as mainstream as a Toyota Corolla.

Re: iPhone Air

#455
post #167

"Impossibly thin" is right in line with Patrick McGee's "Apple in China" who argues that the main reason for Apple's designs is to keep imitators at bay by introducing manufacturing challenges that only they can meet. Indeed impossible at the time of release. One generation after the other. He estimates this gains them about 6 months of headway. Tough world. (Yes, to be fair, there is more to this new phone than just…

The Samsung S25 Edge, which has already been on the market for a while, seems to be pretty popular. It's 0.16mm thicker than the Air. I've got to admit it was surprisingly pleasant to hold. I even did a low key bend test and it did not bend, but I literally had store security walk up to me and ask me not to do that. https://www.samsung.com/us/smartphones/galaxy-s25-edge/

What would you have done if it did bend? It's not meant to be unbendable, which would have made you liable for the damages that happened next.

Re: iPhone Air

#456
post #117

This reminds me of Nokia's glory days around the turn of the millennium, when the mobile phone's essential functionality was well established and they excelled at packaging the same thing into ever-smaller cases made of ever-fancier metals. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_8850/8890 The Motorola Razr of course was part of this trend too: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motorola_Razr_V3

I actually sold my Nakamichi cassette deck to afford the NOKIA Communicator back then. The OS was problematic and couldn’t deliver the functionality that I expected. I ended up switching to a Palm or Handspring device, can't remember which, and stuck with a Nokia monochrome phone until the iPhone came along and changed everything.

Re: iPhone Air

#457
post #208

This has a couple of up sides. 1. Biggest is that Apple can finally tell if people really want a thinner phone (I don’t). Maybe once they find out the answer, they can finally start using the space more productively. 2. They mentioned local LLM in passing, but this is the biggest possible selling point of the executives actually back real work on making them consumer-level easy. Have a LLM marketplace. Let users sub-…

Sigh. I can't stand the camera bump. I would run not walk to the nearest Apple store with all my savings if they made a phone where the camera bump is made flush by adding thickness elsewhere to match, filled with extra battery. Thing would last for weeks. Ah well back to reality.

I see this said all the time but I think people underestimate what an extra few millimeters of thickness would feel like in the hand. Both in terms of grip-ability and weight. I would reckon if people actually got to use a device like that they'd quickly realize they don't want to use it in their day to day.

The iPhone 14 Pro was noticeably heavy, but the switch to titanium the following year made the 15 Pro feel way lighter. The only difference was 206 grams -> 187 grams, but you'd swear it was 25% lighter.

Re: iPhone Air

#458
Really?! It’s 2025 and this is what they saw as important. We need repairable tech not this peanut butter and jelly nonsense that’ll be in the trash heap literal months from now. Feels like we’re back to the old Performa, Centris and Quadra era of rolling our more and more barely differentiated products u til folks loose track of what to buy. Have you been in an Apple Store recently, it’s starting to feel pretty cluttered.

Another data point, Googles own phone ad right now is literally along the lines of ‘feel like your existing phone never changes’, clearly a dig at Apple’s product atrophy.

Re: iPhone Air

#459
I don’t care about how thin the phone is. Let me replace the battery without risking shattering all the glass on the thing.

Re: iPhone Air

#460
post #187

Can someone that is actually interested in this explain the appeal? Thin on its own I get but thin with a giant bump 100% defeats the whole point for me. Seems clear at this point there is little hope of them engineering their way into thin cameras.

iPhone status symbol without having to haul around a huge bulky phone. Most users probably use/need 10% of what a max pro iPhone offers, but they want 100% of the max pro status. Now they can keep the status without needing to carry a chonker.

Umm most people buy them for the hardware. On paper my 16e sounds really good but is crap compared to the 17 pros cameras plus photonic engine. Apple gimps software in non pros. I don't take alot of pics so I don't really care for the pro. Id rather get an old DSLR.
Post reply on HN