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Googler... ex-Googler

nerdy.dev

451–460 of 1001 posts

Re: Googler... ex-Googler

#451

"I'm told this comes as a shock to my managers and other Chrome team leaders. I'm told it's not based on merit" If your manager is shocked by one of their team being laid off, the manager is probably next. Of course the OP was told it wasn't based on merit, or any other arguable-in-court characteristic. But it was. Someone decided Google was better off this way, or that OP was better off working somewhere else.

Managers often feign cluelessness because what else can they do? Tell you they submitted you for layoffs? Tell you they knew for weeks and said nothing? There's really no upside option here. I have no doubt that sometimes managers really don't know, but I'd wager that most who say they didn't know probably did.

I'd wager they didn't.

Lowest person who generally will know will usually be a senior director. Sometimes director. Sometimes VP.

Google is pretty careful about this. While it's true sometimes those people share stuff, it's definitely not en masse, and you can get yourself in significant trouble if you share it when you shouldn't, so it's less times than you think.

At most other places i worked it was different.

Re: Googler... ex-Googler

#452
Other commenters are corect: you are a cog in a machine. You are replaceable. Many people in tech have for too long fallen for the delusion that, as an engineer (or just in tech in general), you are somehow immune to this, that the company does care about you.

All of these big tech companies have never not been insanely profitable. These layoffs aren't necessary for the survival of the business. They're simply suppressing labor costs by cutting 5% of the employees, pushing their duties on the remaining 95% (for no additonal pay of course) and the 95% aren't asking for raises if they fear losing their jobs. It's permanent layoff culture.

Google, Meta, Microsoft, etc all have a ton of inertia, just like IBM did. And that's their future. They are sowing the seeds of their own destruction with short-term profit-seeking. These companies are nothing without the employees that sustain them.

Re: Googler... ex-Googler

#453

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having experienced layoffs in both US and EU companies, the difference is massive. In my experience there is very little respect for "the human" being laid off in US companies People literally would just disappear day to day. I've had several instances where I only found out a colleague had been fired because I tried to write them on Slack only to find that their account had been deactivated Personally I felt constan…

> I don't want to work for another US company again if I can help it You can work for a US company in the UE. They have to follow the local rules like anybody else.

A company that has to "follow the rules" is way less desirable to work for then a company that embraces the spirit of the rules. I'm in the US so can't really speak for companies in other countries, but many US companies are doing everything they can to skirt the letter of the law and spending a ton of money to have them rewritten to be less favorable to employees and more favorable to the business. Finding a company that truly cares for employees is a very rare treat!

Re: Googler... ex-Googler

#454
post #110

Layoffs are a difficult thing for employees and their managers. I have seen people (one was a VP of Engineering) escorted out of the building, sent in a cab to home along with a security guard (this was in India), not allowed access to computer or talk with other employees. But, recently have had a very different experience. The current company I work for announced 30% layoffs. The list was made public within one hou…

Google is just really bad at this, but seems to think it's not bad at this. It's sad since there is no excuse for it - plenty of companies conduct regular layoffs and role eliminations in more compassionate ways, it would not take much to survey and learn from their practices. Hell, IBM was often more compassionate about layoffs than Google.

Some of it they've tried to become more formal about in ways that actually make it worse - so for example, the timing of this (which the person complains about) is because (AFAIK) they now have one day a month where ~all role eliminations that are going to happen that month, happen. Or so i'm told this is the case.

Ostensibly so you don't have random role eliminations every day, which makes some sense, but then you have no way for people on the ground to do anything more compassionate (like move the timing a bit) because they can't get through the bureaucracy.

In the end - it's simple - if you disempower all the people from helping you make it compassionate, it will not be compassionate. The counter argument is usually that those folks don't know how to do it in legally safe/etc ways. But this to me is silly - if you don't trust them to know how to do it, either train them and trust them, or fire them if they simply can't be trusted overall.

Re: Googler... ex-Googler

#455

I've skimmed through the comments; and seen that most people have commented on the cog in the machine thing, or on layoffs in general and how they suck. To me, the shock from this blog post was about seeing a Chrome developer relations engineer whom I have grown to admire and who has been doing a stellar job educating web developers on new html and css features, get the sack. He was one of the best remaining speakers…

It probably just didn't have enough economic value for the company, from your explanation of the role I'm not sure I see the value either. The guy probably earned enough money in a few years that would take me 15 years of work, I'm not sure this as a "personal tragedy".

Completely agree. What is a tragedy though, is that if Google treats their most hardworking engineers like this they are creating a culture of minimal effort. If this is "just a job" as you can expect to be laid off at a moment's notice with no care for the value of your contributions, then what is the point in doing anything more than what the job description entails. It's just incentivizing people to treat their job the same way the company treats their employees. A culture of distrust and minimum effort. It's very sad to see.

Re: Googler... ex-Googler

#456
post #359

I've skimmed through the comments; and seen that most people have commented on the cog in the machine thing, or on layoffs in general and how they suck. To me, the shock from this blog post was about seeing a Chrome developer relations engineer whom I have grown to admire and who has been doing a stellar job educating web developers on new html and css features, get the sack. He was one of the best remaining speakers…

Maybe they're not confident in the case against them: https://www.wired.com/story/the-doj-still-wants-google-to-di...

This round of layoffs wasn't only on the Chrome team but also for Android.

Re: Googler... ex-Googler

#457

I've skimmed through the comments; and seen that most people have commented on the cog in the machine thing, or on layoffs in general and how they suck. To me, the shock from this blog post was about seeing a Chrome developer relations engineer whom I have grown to admire and who has been doing a stellar job educating web developers on new html and css features, get the sack. He was one of the best remaining speakers…

There are very serious talks about forcing google to divest from Chrome/Android, I would bet that's the reason

Re: Googler... ex-Googler

#458
post #110

Layoffs are a difficult thing for employees and their managers. I have seen people (one was a VP of Engineering) escorted out of the building, sent in a cab to home along with a security guard (this was in India), not allowed access to computer or talk with other employees. But, recently have had a very different experience. The current company I work for announced 30% layoffs. The list was made public within one hou…

> the laid off employees were given a few days in the company to allow them to say goodbyes

This is just so wild for me as an European, because at least in Germany if you get fired (or if you quit) you need to stay 1 - 3 MONTHS at the company still.

Re: Googler... ex-Googler

#459
Layoffs are one thing, but to be cut off without any notice, that really sucks. I usually know months in advance that when I'll leave, so I'll have time to finish what I'm working on and train the people who will take over my responsibilities. It seems weirdly destructive for a company not to allow for that.

As for email, calendar etc, I think the lesson here is not to depend on anything from your employer. Keep everything under your own control, so you won't lose too much when you get fired.

Re: Googler... ex-Googler

#460
post #427

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Layoffs in US companies are a BCP event. It's like an earthquake or a tsunami. Weeks of chaos while you figure out who survived, and who's now doing the work previously done by a team that no longer exists. I watched a layoff take out half the security team during an incident. That was fun.

> A business continuity plan (BCP) is a system of prevention and recovery from potential threats to a company. I feel like global acronym bankruptcy is overdue.

I'm reminded of the last part of 'TLA' form the Jargon File (I had a hard copy back in college that I read cover to cover).

http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/T/TLA.html

...

The self-effacing phrase “TDM TLA” (Too Damn Many...) is often used to bemoan the plethora of TLAs in use. In 1989, a random of the journalistic persuasion asked hacker Paul Boutin “What do you think will be the biggest problem in computing in the 90s?” Paul's straight-faced response: “There are only 17,000 three-letter acronyms.” (To be exact, there are 26^3 = 17,576.) There is probably some karmic justice in the fact that Paul Boutin subsequently became a journalist.

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