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Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting

bbc.com

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Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting

#452

If you're an American and want to vent your frustrations, you could try the US Capitol switchboard (202) 224-3121 . You can contact your senator and ask how they are contributing to the safety and prosperity of Americans, or just human beings in general.

My senators are both strongly in support of this. Bill Hagerty's website's top news story is from yesterday, but it pretty much restates everything Trump said today. And I'm sure I don't need to explain Marsha Blackburn's opinion. Republicans gerrymandered the state, so the Representative in the House is about the same. Unless I suddenly win the lottery, I don't think they're interested in hearing my opinion.

Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting

#454

Ukraine is in a bind, and the US has the power to do whatever it wants. But boy, will the nations of the world remember this -- how quickly the US can turn from ally to bully. A really bad day for US foreign policy. The EU is going to be thinking long and hard about the future of NATO now.

Make no mistake, this display was a disgrace, but... after the annexation of Crimea the EU (Germany) moved ahead with Nord Stream 2, we are culpable too, massively. Ironically there's a famous video of none other than Trump lambasting the Germans about it.

Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting

#455
All I can say is that Zelensky is a terrible negotiator. Recognize who you're dealing with, and adjust your stance accordingly. He should have negotiated a little bit but ultimately taken the minerals deal--give Trump the win with his base, and give Trump a reason for the US to join in the fight. Throw in something crazy, like a Trump golf course or a statue or something. He is a simple man to please! These are generational battles that will long outlive either of their egos: be humble and accept that in at least one regard, Trump is right: Ukraine doesn't have the cards.

Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting

#456
post #47

If I were American, I’d be sick with shame. As a European, I’m disgusted—not just by your leadership, but by your silence. Your country is spiraling into disgrace, yet you sit there, watching, complaining online, doing nothing. Where is your outrage? Where are the millions in the streets forcing change? By staying silent, you are complicit. Just like the Russians who let Putin tighten his grip for decades, you are le…

[flagged]

Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting

#457
The whole notion of Pax Americana, just like Pax Britannica before, all the way back to Pax Romana, is that peace (Pax) is in the interest of the dominant empire that enforces it.

Why? Because the dominant empire that enforces it gets the most spoils from that peace. It is why Britain had the biggest empire ever and it's why the US is the richest nation on earth today.

This point seems to be completely missed by Trump, Maga, the US talking heads, and even people in threads like this. If the US withdraws from being "the world's policeman" then it withdraws from its empire.

As a European watching this unfold from the outside, it's hard not to see the actions of the US government as the beginning of the end of US dominance. It will likely hasten the collapse of the US dollar (if you can't force everyone to buy oil in dollars, then the world will shift, likely to Euros), does the US think their currency will remain the ‘reserve currency of choice’ if they isolate themselves from the world? The era of firing up those greenback printing presses whenever you want will be gone.

Isolationism will just lead to Europe recreating (or re-purposing) the institutions that the US was critical in forming (The UN, The World Bank, etc.) and looking to be its own world peacekeeper. It will eventually move the dominance to whichever nation or nations fill the vacuum. The US will get poorer. It may not collapse, but you can't withdraw from being the dominant empire and there be no financial consequences. Just look at the collapse of the British empire.

The problem is that this won't happen overnight. And the process of the US withdrawing will certainly lead to wars, maybe even a third world war. The withdrawal of its soft power via USAID will likely lead to famines, health crises, migrations, and a lot more refugees.

You may think that we can just 'sit it out' and wait for Trump's term to complete. But, it's obvious that the Republican party is now the MAGA party. The former allies of the US need to realise that this is it. They need to fill the space as fast as possible and move forward without the US. The US is not an ally any more.

It really is the last thing we needed after a financial crisis, a pandemic, and with the existential crisis - climate change - being ever more kicked into the long grass.

I despair for where this is heading :(

Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting

#459

George Washington's farewell address (1796) - on Europe: The great rule of conduct for us in regard to foreign nations is in extending our commercial relations, to have with them as little political connection as possible. So far as we have already formed engagements, let them be fulfilled with perfect good faith. Here let us stop. Europe has a set of primary interests which to us have none; or a very remote relation…

Ah yes, the 1770s. Basically no difference between now and then. Every idea from the 1770s is perfectly relevant to the modern world /s
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