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Australia/Lord_Howe is the weirdest timezone

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Re: Australia/Lord_Howe is the weirdest timezone

#451
post #341

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same with Somali. The first hour of daylight is hal saac (Hour 1) 7 AM is 1 Saac ( Hour 1) 6 PM is 12 Saac ( Hour 12) 7 PM is 1 Saac 6 AM is 12 Saac

> 7 AM is 1 Saac > 7 PM is 1 Saac How do you distinguish AM/PM? How does one say that something will happen 19:00 specifically, and not 07:00?

Morning and Afternoon are used for AM and PM, or if you want to be really specific you can use the name of the hour, for example 10 am is called barqo, and 18 hours is called himhimmow

https://digitalcommons.macalester.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?ar...

Re: Australia/Lord_Howe is the weirdest timezone

#452
post #333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the continental US can do it (and it looks like it might soon, with California voting for it) I'm not sure I buy that argument. Heck if China can survive on one timezone...

I think it's the changing times that people don't like, rather than standard time. I'd prefer California to stay on standard time instead of staying on DST, so noon will be aligned with solar noon. (It is, right? I never actually checked.)

Well… it’s not uniform.

Take today, Nov 1st 2024, solar noon is at the following times in the State in these locations:

1pm, Crescent City: https://www.timeanddate.com/astronomy/@11788520

12:53pm, San Francisco: https://www.timeanddate.com/astronomy/usa/san-francisco

12:36pm, Los Angeles: https://www.timeanddate.com/astronomy/usa/los-angeles

12:32pm, San Diego: https://www.timeanddate.com/astronomy/usa/san-diego

It’s tempting to want to put stock in solar noon as the the thing the day should be aligned around, but honestly it’s probably overrated. Personally, I much prefer daylight savings time over standard time if I had to pick only one.

Re: Australia/Lord_Howe is the weirdest timezone

#453
post #449
post #438

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know if you follow my argument, which is: > DST actually makes most sense in 30-40 degrees of latitude. I am not arguing for having "year-round DST", nor for not having any DST at all. All I'm saying is this: at 50th parallel, there's plenty of daylight in the summer, and so: people should just figure out what to do in the winter -- and stick with it all year round. At 25th parallel, there's not much variance…

Summer daylight is not scarce. Between the 30th and 40th parallel is the bottom half of the United States. DST exists so that the sun doesn't rise around 5am. And that seems to be what the argument boils down to: "I don't want it bright too early". The sun is going down around 8pm during DST on the 30th. If you're arguing to keep doing what we're doing, you've managed to have an even wronger opinion than getting rid…

   > DST exists so that the sun doesn't rise around 5am. 
No, DST exists so the sun doesn't set around 6pm.

   > And that seems to be what the argument boils down to: "I don't want it bright too early".
No, it's not "I", it's about "we the people", and "we the people" don't care as much about "bright too early", rather they care about "dark too early".

Here is a map of the offset between solar noon and civil noon[0]. The blue places have solar noon (sun in its highest position) before their local clocks show 12h00. The red places have solar noon after their clocks show that. The white places have it about the same time.

Several observations:

1. This is without DST. With DST, blue places turn red, and red places turn even more red.

2. The map is kinda outdated, the bluest most populous country -- Turkey -- moved an hour since, so now it's white at the east and red otherwise.

3. Greenland looks the size of Africa, which is a projection issue, in fact it's much smaller, and that's even before we talk about its minuscule population.

4. There are places like Recife in Brazil, where solar noon varies between 11h03 and 11h33, but they still have more than 12 hours of sunlight most of year, and never less than 11:45, so they hardly care.

5. The vast, vast majority of the world would rather have the solar noon after 12h00 -- meaning, more light in the evening than in the early morning. Santiago de Compostella has solar noon at 13h17 at the earliest and 14h40 at the latest, "relocating" around two hours.

6. The bluest city in the USA is probably Boston, and during standard time their solar noon is 11h30-11h59. During DST, it's 12h40-12h50.

[0] http://blog.poormansmath.net/images/SolarTimeVsStandardTimeV...

Re: Australia/Lord_Howe is the weirdest timezone

#454

Earlier this year I had to write a function to find the current local time given a US address. The naive way to do so would be via a static mapping of state to time zone but there are a few edge cases that preclude doing this; in the interest of cost and speed relative to this specific application I spent a few dollars on a CSV that maps every US ZIP code to UTC offset and whether DST is followed (among other data).…

> Earlier this year I had to write a function to find the current local time given a US address.

I also did something similar earlier this year, though I used a geolocation service to translate address to lat/long coords, and then used lat/long to translate to timezone. (With shortcuts single-timezone states)

I ended up using this python library for lat/long -> timezone converstion:

https://github.com/jannikmi/timezonefinder

Which sources its data from here, which seems like a pretty high quality source:

https://github.com/evansiroky/timezone-boundary-builder/rele...

Re: Australia/Lord_Howe is the weirdest timezone

#455

Excellent read around the acrobatics of timezone software. It really is quite flexible. It leads me to wonder. If it's all just an automated and finite offset, there's no reason for daylight savings policies to hew to 60 minutes adjustments. Couldn't a nation decide to have a continuously changing offset throughout the year? It might make their offset lookup table substantially longer, but this could 'solve' daylight…

Part of the issue with DST is that it makes it hard to have a consistent repeating weekly meeting time across multiple time zones that switch at different times (US vs Europe for example).

It would mean that the repeating meeting time would be at a slightly different local time every week.

Re: Australia/Lord_Howe is the weirdest timezone

#457
post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm just so relieved that Disney didn't buy Star Trek. Was slightly concerned by an offhand remark from the Doctor in the most recent Doctor Who series who made an off-hand comment about dropping in on the Star Trek people.

Coincidentally, Doctor Who has an unusual system where individual writers own the copyright to some of the characters they introduce, which means there's a lot of not-very-good spinoff novels (and an Australian TV show) featuring only that authors' characters.

Not sure that's the case now, but certainly was the case in the 60s and 70s with BBCs terms at the time.

Re: Australia/Lord_Howe is the weirdest timezone

#458

Earlier this year I had to write a function to find the current local time given a US address. The naive way to do so would be via a static mapping of state to time zone but there are a few edge cases that preclude doing this; in the interest of cost and speed relative to this specific application I spent a few dollars on a CSV that maps every US ZIP code to UTC offset and whether DST is followed (among other data).…

> The naive way to do so would be via a static mapping of state to time zone but there are a few edge cases that preclude doing this More than a few, state is really the wrong resolution here, US timezones follow counties and native reservations borders. ZIP codes should probably be good enough but I'd be careful too. If your volume of addresses isn't too crazy, the robust way is to reverse geocode them and use a lib…

> US timezones follow counties and native reservations borders.

It's worse than that; Malheur County on the eastern border of Oregon is split between Pacific and Mountain time based on whether cities are more economically connected to Idaho or Nevada: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malheur_County,_Oregon#Time_zo...

Re: Australia/Lord_Howe is the weirdest timezone

#459
post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is common across East Africa, including Kenya where I’m from. The night ends at 6:00AM, with 7:00AM being saa moja (first hour) of the day. Similarly, the day ends at 6:00PM (thenashara). Intuitively, this clock makes much more sense than the English clock. There’s rarely confusion between times because it’s embedded in the language.

Everyone I work with in Kenya uses standard dates and times. It’s a requirement when you work internationally.

Of course. That doesn't mean they are not familiar with the local traditional system though. They just can use both, as in many other countries such as Japan and China and in the Middle East for example.

Re: Australia/Lord_Howe is the weirdest timezone

#460

Oh wow, what a coincidence, I was just looking at Lord Howe Island on a map of species conservation. For anyone who doesn't know: Lord Howe Island is the last true paradise on Earth . I went there on holidays a few years back based on two travel review recommendations. Both were by professional travellers that had been to pretty much everywhere, and both said it's the best place they've ever been . The reasoning was…

But did you see the stick insects?
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