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Zed, a collaborative code editor, is now open source

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Re: Zed, a collaborative code editor, is now open source

#451

Post by c-c-c-c-c »

Shish2k wrote: post #154
c-c-c-c-c wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please not ala vscode-server over SSH. Do it proper like emacs tramp so it will connect to any platforms/architectures.

“Please don’t do it like a 4x4 truck, do it proper, like a bicycle” — there is some overlap between those things, but for people who are actually making full use of the former, the latter is not a useful suggestion

The former is bad design, it has no gradual fallback and works in a terrifying way. It pulls binaries from MS servers and runs a headless vscode instance on the remote machine. You are dead in the water if you target a machine/architecture it doesnt support.

You want to target FreeBSD? Linux on POWER or RISC-V? An old (ARMV6-TDMI) Raspberry Pi? Sorry, no remote work for you.

They are not an apple and pears comparison...

Re: Zed, a collaborative code editor, is now open source

#452

Post by DiabloD3 »

TotempaaltJ wrote: post #443
DiabloD3 wrote: post #413

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really consider the SO survey useful anymore. It seems to be hyper-selected to just Silicon Valley techbros, instead of either the more general US tech industry, or the worldwide tech industry. If the Silicon Valley is just a bubble, then the two bubbles I live in (life-long FOSS/Linux guy, but also deep into the hosting/transit/non-eyeball end of the Internet), every single Mac owner I know does not run OSX,…

Certainly sounds like you're hyper-selecting to your own biases and ignoring real evidence when it doesn't agree with your personal observations.

Yes? I literally just said "HN hyper-selects their own bubble, but if I do it, I get entirely different results; neither of them are likely to be correct."

Re: Zed, a collaborative code editor, is now open source

#453

Post by [deleted] »

flakes wrote: post #434
DiabloD3 wrote: post #413

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really consider the SO survey useful anymore. It seems to be hyper-selected to just Silicon Valley techbros, instead of either the more general US tech industry, or the worldwide tech industry. If the Silicon Valley is just a bubble, then the two bubbles I live in (life-long FOSS/Linux guy, but also deep into the hosting/transit/non-eyeball end of the Internet), every single Mac owner I know does not run OSX,…

> It seems to be hyper-selected to just Silicon Valley techbros, instead of either the more general US tech industry, or the worldwide tech industry. How do you validate this claim? The country demographic in the survey shows that USA makes up only 21% of responses. https://survey.stackoverflow.co/2023/#section-key-territorie...

[deleted]

Re: Zed, a collaborative code editor, is now open source

#454

Post by gloosx »

AI helpers, Chats and Calls??? Microsoft log-in, Commercial plans, Telemetry? Seems like an overload of everything for an editor - more distractions not a new way to code. Def sticking with good old nvim for some longer time, no better editing experience engineered yet

Re: Zed, a collaborative code editor, is now open source

#455

Post by [deleted] »

Cu3PO42 wrote: post #335
kristopolous wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm just sour about lack of Linux support, it's like I'm in 1998 again except now instead of Microsoft Windows ignoring us it's Apple macOS. A WINE like project for macOS software would be great

There is! It's called Darling [1]. Unfortunately, its GUI support is experimental and still very limited, so you won't be able to run Zed right now, but I still think the project is very cool. [1] https://www.darlinghq.org/

[deleted]

Re: Zed, a collaborative code editor, is now open source

#456

Post by DiabloD3 »

flakes wrote: post #434
DiabloD3 wrote: post #413

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really consider the SO survey useful anymore. It seems to be hyper-selected to just Silicon Valley techbros, instead of either the more general US tech industry, or the worldwide tech industry. If the Silicon Valley is just a bubble, then the two bubbles I live in (life-long FOSS/Linux guy, but also deep into the hosting/transit/non-eyeball end of the Internet), every single Mac owner I know does not run OSX,…

> It seems to be hyper-selected to just Silicon Valley techbros, instead of either the more general US tech industry, or the worldwide tech industry. How do you validate this claim? The country demographic in the survey shows that USA makes up only 21% of responses. https://survey.stackoverflow.co/2023/#section-key-territorie...

The reverse of this is, I don't know how SO can validate the claim, or the accuracy of any of the results in the SO survey.

If a lot of people self-select themselves to align with techbro culture, techbro culture is mainly in the Silicon Valley but not only there, and they think, for example, owning a Mac is how you signal belonging to that group (as in, Macs are a modern day Veblen good), then people who think they are (or wish they were) part of the techbro culture, no matter their location, will buy Macs.

So, the claim being given by people quoting the SO survey is: SO survey responders are not mainly made up of people who self-identify as techbros or have had their purchasing decisions (such as buying a Mac) greatly influenced by techbro culture.

I do not know of a way to argue that position. You can state that, literally, techbros live outside of the US, which is obviously true without quoting this survey; it however, does not mean the Silicon Valley doesn't act as an echo chamber, and doesn't have great effect on the tech industry worldwide.

What I would more likely want to see is, of that 21% of America, how many live in either the Silicon Valley or the Seattle/Redmond region. As in, how many are hailing from the Chicago or New York or Dallas metros, or non-metro regions entirely.

I'm guessing that, still, many would have responded that they live in either the SV or the northwest, greatly more-so than elsewhere in the US.

Re: Zed, a collaborative code editor, is now open source

#457

Post by natrys »

darthrupert wrote: post #418
benreesman wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m really picky about my tools in general and latency in particular, and I give Zed a spin from time to time, it’s sweet. Clean, minimal design aesthetic, tree-sitter, tight code, it’s a nice bit of work and I dig it a lot. But emacs 29 with the right flags and a tuned GC (no one does this! it’s got a heap-size from the 80s!) is just as snappy and has more amazing packages than VSCode. There’s a market for people wh…

People are asking what settings would be useful to tweak. Check out the following: - gcmh -package and gcmh-mode and/or gc-cons-threshold variable (former should take over the latter) - read-process-output-max - jit-lock-defer-time - package-native-compile Doom Emacs sets gcmh in its initialization so tweaking that might not be needed there. You may still want to touch gcmh-high-cons-threshold and gcmh-idle-delay-fac…

The thing about gc-cons-threshold is that, too low a value and it will collect garbage too frequently. While a high value will drastically reduce frequency, but then GC pause will be big and you will likely feel whole system freeze and stutter when it happens. For me, 1GB is too high because I sorta notice the pause, I set it to 32MB but completely disable GC when minibuffer is active:

    (defun my-minibuffer-setup-hook ()
      (setq gc-cons-threshold most-positive-fixnum))

    (defun my-minibuffer-exit-hook ()
      (setq gc-cons-threshold (* 32 1024 1024)))

    (add-hook 'minibuffer-setup-hook #'my-minibuffer-setup-hook)
    (add-hook 'minibuffer-exit-hook #'my-minibuffer-exit-hook)
Eli Zaretskii (current Emacs maintainer) also thinks 1GB is too high, though for somewhat different reason:

https://old.reddit.com/r/emacs/comments/bg85qm/garbage_colle...

Here is an interesting optimisation that was merged in master, but didn't make the cut for 29 in time. I thought it improved snappiness:

https://tdodge.consulting/blog/living-the-emacs-garbage-coll...

---

Anyway, I also have these in my init (I nicked these from Doom which I don't use but they have done a lot of work to dive deep into these things, mostly around what improves start up but the following might help in general):

    ;; if you don't use RTL ever, this could improve perf
    (setq-default bidi-display-reordering 'left-to-right
                  bidi-paragraph-direction 'left-to-right
                  bidi-inhibit-bpa t)

    ;; improves terminal emulator (vterm/eat) throughput
    (setq read-process-output-max (* 2 1024 1024)
          process-adaptive-read-buffering nil)

    (setq fast-but-imprecise-scrolling t
          redisplay-skip-fontification-on-input t
          inhibit-compacting-font-caches t)

    (setq idle-update-delay 1.0)

Re: Zed, a collaborative code editor, is now open source

#458

Post by eviks »

wastewastewaste wrote: post #448
eviks wrote: post #405

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of things, from limited keybinding support due to terminal limits, unergonomic extension language, very poor default setup, lacking good GUI, poor multicursor support, lack of core Zed's feature - collaboration

I know that's just a minor point, but I don't think you ever really need multicursor if you have access to vim features

Those features are a worse substitute for that awesome generic UI mechanism called immediate visual feedback (for the same reason Helix's visual-first mode, which unfortunately neovim also lacks, is better)

Re: Zed, a collaborative code editor, is now open source

#459

Post by madeofpalk »

yoyohello13 wrote: post #277
madeofpalk wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm really keen for Windows support, but only if it means WSL. I hope their architecture allows for it.

When they get linux support you could probably run it in WSL, since WSL supports GUI apps now.

I don't think I would like that. I haven't been impressed with the experience of running GUI apps within WSL. Weird window controls/resizing, compositing, and font rendering issues would be a hard blocker from using this as probably the second most important app on my computer.

Re: Zed, a collaborative code editor, is now open source

#460

Post by widdershins »

erk__ wrote: post #423
widdershins wrote: post #420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been impressed with the C++ clangd language server snappiness in Zed compared to both CLion (my old favorite) and Emacs (apple of my eye for 2.5 yrs). I always thought the major slowness was coming from clangd itself, so I'm surprised and impressed to see that Zed appears to be quicker on this front. I might be using Zed as a 'second opinion' editor because of this. However, now I'm used to the infinite customiz…

Emacs have some issues with LSP speed because of the json parsing not being the fastest which have lead to work like this: https://github.com/blahgeek/emacs-lsp-booster .

Ah, thanks for the link, I hadn't seen that. I will give Eglot another go with this set up!
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