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Meta to ask many managers to become individual contributors or leave

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Re: Meta to ask many managers to become individual contributors or leave

#451

Post by klabb3 »

r00fus wrote: post #57
disgruntledphd2 wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look man, Apple tanked Facebooks valuation, not the Metaverse. And that's presumably why he wants the Metaverse, so he's not just a sharecropper on someone else's digital platform.

I absolutely don't know why Facebook balked at making their own phone back in the day. Facebook's entire value prop about 10-15 years ago was the fact that you could find anyone on there who you even remotely knew. Imagine (10 years ago) being able to use an FB version of Siri/Alexa to "connect me to that girl Megan from my 5th grade classroom". Sure sounds compelling. Instead FB released a half-assed "dailer app/wid…

> Imagine (10 years ago) being able to use an FB version of Siri/Alexa to "connect me to that girl Megan from my 5th grade classroom". Sure sounds compelling.

I agree that fbs value was/is the social graph. But you’re saying that there was a lack of voice UI? Or lack of a capable mobile experience? I don’t see how any of that could have been more than marginally helpful in reducing the friction of adding a friend on a social network.

Re: Meta to ask many managers to become individual contributors or leave

#453

Post by lxm »

_9omd wrote: post #446

Chamath talked about manager bloat on a recent All-in podcast in a way that seemed to make sense. Basically there is pressure to grow your career by moving from being an IC to a manager and once a manager there are incentives to grow your number of reports. The organizational efficiency suffers when you have top tier ICs start managing teams of average people. You might get a team of 6 engineers that’s only doing 2x…

Imagine what Michelangelo could’ve accomplished if he was tasked with managing a team of painters.

Re: Meta to ask many managers to become individual contributors or leave

#454

Post by heleninboodler »

gnicholas wrote: post #190
bityard wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Somebody at Meta worked really hard to make sure that when I'm using Facebook on my phone to read someone's post or comment thread, it punishes me for taking a call or answering a text message by reloading my feed with a set of completely different posts when I re-enter the app, and then making it impossible to find the previous post or thread again. No other app has gone to such extraordinary lengths to make sure yo…

I use FB via browser and have not experienced this behavior there. But I do see it in the LinkedIn app all the time. Even if you click into a posted article, when you exit from the article you won't be able to find the post so you can comment on it!

I use FB via browser and this is constant on iOS. If I am going through my feed and I click a link to another site, it opens a new tab and when I return to the FB tab I see it reload the page and I lose my spot. If I try to scroll down to find the same item I clicked on (because for example I feel like commenting), it's almost always gone. Nowadays I just take it as a reminder that FB is either deliberately manipulating me or just doesn't care about the UX, so I close the FB tab. I'm not doing extra work to make up for their user-hostile decisions.

Re: Meta to ask many managers to become individual contributors or leave

#455

Post by nsajko »

lxm wrote: post #453
_9omd wrote: post #446

Chamath talked about manager bloat on a recent All-in podcast in a way that seemed to make sense. Basically there is pressure to grow your career by moving from being an IC to a manager and once a manager there are incentives to grow your number of reports. The organizational efficiency suffers when you have top tier ICs start managing teams of average people. You might get a team of 6 engineers that’s only doing 2x…

Imagine what Michelangelo could’ve accomplished if he was tasked with managing a team of painters.

Is this ironic, I can't tell?

"The Mythical Man-Month" seems relevant in any case.

Re: Meta to ask many managers to become individual contributors or leave

#456

Post by ttoinou »

nsajko wrote: post #455
lxm wrote: post #453

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine what Michelangelo could’ve accomplished if he was tasked with managing a team of painters.

Is this ironic, I can't tell? "The Mythical Man-Month" seems relevant in any case.

Has to be ironic, since that's what Michelangelo did

Re: Meta to ask many managers to become individual contributors or leave

#457

Post by solarmist »

pvarangot wrote: post #449
solarmist wrote: post #419

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The distinguishing factor I've seen is servant leadership [1]. They believe that supporting and developing their people is their main job. Execution is just a prerequisite to being able to do the rest. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Servant_leadership

> The distinguishing factor I've seen is servant leadership I've never encountered a servant leadership styled EM that is not also a good IC.

I have, actually; my two best examples were not great engineers. They were passable, but their strengths really came out in management.

Re: Meta to ask many managers to become individual contributors or leave

#458

Post by ncann »

likeabbas wrote: post #427
karaterobot wrote: post #386

It's too bad, because the best managers I've worked with were not good ICs, but they did multiply the effectiveness of the ICs they worked with, and so were absolutely invaluable to the company in a way that may not have shown up on paper. If those people exist in FB, as I'm sure they must, then they'd presumably get jettisoned as a result of this choice. That would be bad long term. I used to despise managers, until…

IMO the easiest way to solve this issue would be to normalize ICs making more than their managers. That way, only the people who really want to be managers are managing.

I agree. Too often people feel becoming manager is the easiest way to advance their career (which most of the time equates to making more money). In many cases becoming manager is the only way to advance their career in the current org.

Re: Meta to ask many managers to become individual contributors or leave

#459

Post by brookst »

likeabbas wrote: post #427
karaterobot wrote: post #386

It's too bad, because the best managers I've worked with were not good ICs, but they did multiply the effectiveness of the ICs they worked with, and so were absolutely invaluable to the company in a way that may not have shown up on paper. If those people exist in FB, as I'm sure they must, then they'd presumably get jettisoned as a result of this choice. That would be bad long term. I used to despise managers, until…

IMO the easiest way to solve this issue would be to normalize ICs making more than their managers. That way, only the people who really want to be managers are managing.

It's an interesting thought, but I don't know how you "normalize" it if companies find that they are more profitable paying managers more.

Re: Meta to ask many managers to become individual contributors or leave

#460

Post by Aeolun »

conductr wrote: post #152
flashgordon wrote: post #67

I had cautiously gotten into management because I wanted to learn the skills of delegatin and really building through others and growing/coaching others. I thoroughly enjoyed this. But over time what I had realized was the role had been changing (not sure if it was just for pandering) towards being a mouth piece for leadership and hr - having to relay decisions I didn't believe in (perf seasons, promo rationales, lay…

The best thing you can do in these roles is protect your team. It's your primary job to ensure they can build and with minimal wasted efforts. If you view it as building for the company, your team is a victim to all the dysfunctions of the organization and nobody wants to be on that team. The mouthpiece part is tricky, I always try to give the official message with a dose of my personal candid opinion on it even if i…

> they're aware of the risks that are at top of your minds.

Not that I expect them to do anything with it…

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