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SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

nytimes.com

451–460 of 1001 posts

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#451

To those arguing that this letter is tantamount to insubordination and is therefore a fireable offense: “Insubordination (noun)- refusing to obey orders from someone in authority.” [1] Unless they had received direct orders not to criticize Musk at all, internally or externally, they are not guilty of refusing to obey orders. And if they had received such orders, that only adds to Musk’s burgeoning reputation for pet…

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Could you please define "woke culture" for me?

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#452
post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He's at his lowest point in the eyes of the media (which is how most of us see the world) but hes actually at the highest point in his career and achievements. Tesla is about to explode in production with their "biggest building in the world factory" in texas, berlin and china. SpaceX is about to achieve the holy grail of the space industry (an affordable and reusable rocket) not to mention Starlink.

Tesla cars are garbage, speaking as a Tesla owner. They demo nicely, but they are put together poorly. The minute there's any meaningful competition they'll crumble. Combined with the risks from their autopilot system and their mistreatment of workers and their CEO being a right wing edgelord? There's plenty of reasons to think Tesla might not be on a good path.

>they are put together poorly

This depends a lot on the factory / year of production. E.g. the 2021/2022 from Giga Shanghai have great quality. Of course, consistency is the key, Tesla has to achieve it across all of the factories.

And I have no idea what 'risks' are you talking about regarding autopilot.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#453
Based on what management said it wasn't necessarily what was in the letter, but the behavior surrounding the formation of the letter and soliciting people to sign it. Basically they were fired for using company resources for personal use and intimidation of their peers.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#454
post #110

This is a very predictable consequence of criticizing your employer via a public letter. Criticize internally all you want, and influence the changes that you want to see happen. Employment is a two-way relationship. If you don't like your employer, you are free to leave. If they don't like you, they are free to fire you (within legal bounds). Publishing an openly critical letter and signing it is a quick way to get…

Everybody knows that he's within his rights to fire them. It just throws cold water on all his grandstanding about being a "free speech absolutist". EDIT: Everyone telling me that company employees are different from Twitter are missing the point. We know that. But he clearly doesn't care about free speech "absolutely" when he throws a fit that his employees are criticizing him.

Being a free speech absolutist has nothing to do with consequences from invoking your free speech. Everyone wanting free speech despite what type of speech that they legally allow is the price we pay to have it. Invoking it and using ignorant, racist or hatefull language doesn't mean you won't pay a social price for it. It just means we won't throw you in jail using the state for it. But you may just lose your jobs. Thems' the breaks.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#455
post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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People who spend too much time on twitter think they have seen the left go off the deep end. But what insane policy has actually occurred? Biden isn't off the deep end. Meanwhile the right has actually passed laws to tear apart families with trans kids, have actually passed laws to turn citizens into vigilantes to track down women having abortions, have actually tried to stage an insurrection, have actually put disho…

I mean our government just nominated a Disinformation Bureau in a country known for its protection of free speech.

They dropped it after being ridiculed, but I mean the President was suggesting the government control speech.

That’s a slide into tier two.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#456
post #110

This is a very predictable consequence of criticizing your employer via a public letter. Criticize internally all you want, and influence the changes that you want to see happen. Employment is a two-way relationship. If you don't like your employer, you are free to leave. If they don't like you, they are free to fire you (within legal bounds). Publishing an openly critical letter and signing it is a quick way to get…

No post body was provided.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#457

To those arguing that this letter is tantamount to insubordination and is therefore a fireable offense: “Insubordination (noun)- refusing to obey orders from someone in authority.” [1] Unless they had received direct orders not to criticize Musk at all, internally or externally, they are not guilty of refusing to obey orders. And if they had received such orders, that only adds to Musk’s burgeoning reputation for pet…

Quoted post unavailable.

> It can't be good working conditions to have a small group of people playing victim and antagonizing others

So you're saying musk should step down?

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#458

I can't imagine trashing my CEO and expecting to keep my job. Maybe that's a Gen-X thing?

Maybe they actually believed his statements regarding unlimited free speech. It's not backed by evidence but SpaceX does attract dreamers.

I don’t think any definition of free speech guarantees total freedom from repercussions?

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#459

I can't imagine trashing my CEO and expecting to keep my job. Maybe that's a Gen-X thing?

Maybe they actually believed his statements regarding unlimited free speech. It's not backed by evidence but SpaceX does attract dreamers.

The other thread is full of this nonsense. You give the impression that you believe that free speech absolutists think you ought to be allowed to walk up to your CEO and tell him to go fuck himself, without retaliation. What other things would you have us believe that free speech absolutists would allow? Catcalling coworkers, perhaps? Threatening to murder someone's children?

No, you just want to snipe at Musk, and you see this is a way to do it.

Re: SpaceX said to fire employees involved in letter rebuking Elon Musk

#460

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

> It can't be good working conditions to have a small group of people playing victim and antagonizing others So you're saying musk should step down?

Your snark makes no sense. Are you saying Elon is a small group of people?

Clearly I was talking about the group who sent out the unsolicited internal letter in work channels.

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