Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

engadget.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

451–460 of 1001 posts

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#451

Post by urgentmessage »

Hamcha wrote: post #86
qalmakka wrote: post #2

2024? There's still plenty of time for them to remove the port altogether and go with just MagSafe/Qi. Which they control, and they still can get fees from. Trust me when I say that Apple will NEVER submit to this legislation, they will find every sort of obscure or arcane tricks to comply with it without actually doing it. It would set a precedent that legislating can change Apple's behaviour, which they clearly do…

If it's going down to a pettiness war, I don't think the legislators will give up that easily. Apple reacting in a petty way not only shows that the legislators were right on the money (while adapting shows they were forced, whether for good or bad) but gives them even more reason to push the buttons further. Digital Markets Act is definitely getting more fuel and attention after Apple's petty response to ACM's compl…

you seem to think that annoying Apple creates welfare for EU citizens

But it doesn't.

Regulators may "win" a battle. But consumers lose big time. And I don't think bureaucrats should take precedence versus consumers.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#452

Post by Spivak »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #92
mrjin wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just pick a couple of those USB-C docks on the market and check how many are actually working for you. I used over 10 different USB-C docks from different vendors. It doesn't matter which vendor, they all have various issues. They might be perfectly fine for some machines but lots lots of troubles for some other machines which are also perfectly fine with some of the other docks. I have never seen something worse tha…

>Just pick a couple of those USB-C docks on the market and check how many are actually working for you. 1) How is it the spec's fault that random OEMs go to extreme cost cutting measures in order to price dump themselves to the bottom by not following the spec? Of course they won't work properly. But again, for the 100th time, that's not the specs fault that manufacturers actively choose to ignore it. If a driver cho…

Looks this isn’t that complicated, what people want is the ability to know that I all conforming USB-C cables are identical and can be interchanged freely. I don’t give two shits about the devices at the ends not being able to negotiate or different power bricks charging faster or slower.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#453

Post by colejohnson66 »

jayd16 wrote: post #409
maccard wrote: post #7

The problem with USB-C is that you can't just pick up a device cable and power brick and expect them to work together. As an example, my Apple 96W USB-C charger doesn't charge my nintendo switch. The cable that came with my phone doesn't charge said fully Mac when used with the 96w charger. There is no indication of incompatibility between these devices until you realise they don't work. This is going back to the dc…

>you can't just pick up a device cable and power brick and expect them to work together I never understood this sentiment. That would be even more true if USB-C wasn't the standard so I don't really understand the complaint. Obviously "same shape" isn't an indicator that it will "just work" for USB-C, so why would we expect that to be the case for anything else with modern complexity? It would be nice if fits == work…

Because USB has always been, "if it fits, it works (possibly with a driver)". Maybe not explicitly, but it was widely understood to be that. USB-C, OTOH, with all its modes and whatnot, make it so I can't tell what my device supports, and a driver installer won't fix it.

Basically, things that require extra ICs are now being shoved into "one connector for all" thing with no way of telling them apart.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#454

Post by metalliqaz »

theptip wrote: post #450

So every upgrading iPhone user in the world needs to discard every single charging device they own, including expensive multi-device chargers like phone+watch. In the short-term this clearly produces _more_ e-waste. I wonder if anyone made an estimate of the break-even time here. One year? Ten? Will everyone be discarding their chargers and switching to wireless before break-even is achieved? How much money does it c…

No reason to toss everything until your current phone is no longer used. And Apple isn't exactly shy about changing their connectors, so such might already be the case for upcoming phones. In any case, I'm pretty sure Apple will go to to full wireless before long.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#455

Post by [deleted] »

rob_c wrote: post #29
asutekku wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, doesn't still mean we should stagnate and be forced to use tech that is basically obsolete for a modern world's requirements.

I wouldn't stand on the hill of this is obsolete tech, there should be more devices built with power efficiency from the ground up as well as less focus on the USBC charges your phone faster. This is more about usbc will charge every device you have in a few years so no reaching for custom chargers. Usbc->X cables however are another matter nothing is stopping HP making a custom usbc->HP port for their laptops for in…

[deleted]

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#456

Post by AprilArcus »

pkulak wrote: post #424
908B64B197 wrote: post #416

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except if you use Lightning. It just works.

Because it's not an open standard any only support low-power devices. If we gimped USB-C to only support 5 volts, it would work everywhere too.

iPhone fast charging over lightning runs at 9 volts.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#457

Post by samzub »

mlindner wrote: post #447

Imagine they had made this dumb decision back when Micro USB was the standard. We would have never gotten anything better than Micro USB. Governments shouldn't be in the market of mandating that a specific technical standards must be used as it freezes innovation. Also purely in terms of usability, the Apple thunderbolt plug is easier to clean and less error prone on insertion as it self-centers.

It looks like they did at the time : https://www.engadget.com/2010-12-29-european-standardization...

I think standardization does not harm innovation. With more actors working on the same standard, it can evolve and get better while consumers are able to reuse hardware (here, phone chargers)

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#458

Post by xxpor »

gpderetta wrote: post #36
maccard wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how am I supposed to know that when looking at a device that has a USB-C port for charging, and the instructions on the charger [0] say "Nintendo Switch can be charged by plugging the AC adapter into the console's USB Type-C connector." [0] https://store.nintendo.co.uk/en_gb/-nintendo-switch-power-ad...

You are not supposed to, but it seems to me that the blame is on Nintendo, not with USB-C.

Nintendo always does something that's JUST slightly off with their consoles that make them annoying as hell to use.

With the switch it's the screwed up USB-C implementation and the fact that you can't use bluetooth headphones (it has BT support, but only for the controllers)

With the DS, the wifi only supported WEP, not WPA, even though WPA2 had been released by the time the DS came out

The Wii famously didn't support HD output.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#459

Post by nybble41 »

kiawe_fire wrote: post #305
amluto wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In the long term however competition between these different standards will cause consolidation and overall technology improvement. If you think that’s a superior solution, then the regulation should actually support it: require that all EV charging connectors have a free published specification, disallow patents on them, and require that interoperability be permitted without cost or other penalty. (e.g. anyone sho…

I was set to be all libertarian about this, but your suggestion is probably more level headed. There should be some common ground. Regulations that encourage innovation (perhaps even with timed financial incentives) while also ensuring that the best ideas are eventually freely adoptable across the board. Seems like, as with most issues, people take one extreme or the other, when a common sense middle ground could be…

> I was set to be all libertarian about this…

Disallowing patents is the libertarian solution, though it would be up to the customers to demand published specifications and official support for interoperability.

Re: EU reaches deal to make USB-C a common charger for most electronic devices

#460

Post by 908B64B197 »

cmckn wrote: post #418

I kind of understand this from an e-waste angle, but why (as a consumer) do I care if different phones use the same cable? I only have one phone. Even if I get a new phone every year, unless I’m switching back and forth between iPhones and Androids, I’m not having to buy new cables. If I go to a public place, and need to plug my phone in, I can already do that regardless of the connector on the phone end. If a friend…

> unless I’m switching back and forth between iPhones and Androids, I’m not having to buy new cables.

Even if you did. Lightning's been around since 2012. It superseded the Dock connector every iPod and iPhone had since 2003. At this point they are pretty ubiquitous.

> Apple charges license fees on Lightning

This also prevents the mess that is USB-C where vendors don't implement the spec correctly (and brick unsuspecting devices in the process, see Nintendo). Apple can just refuse to license devices from vendors that don't implement the spec correctly.

Post reply on HN