Live data from Hacker News

Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

usatoday.com

451–460 of 612 posts

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#451

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ford reorganized back in March so that their EV business (Model e) is separate from the legacy ICE business (Ford Blue). There was speculation at the time that this was in part free itself of the dealership sales model. The dealers would keep the dying ICE business while the fast growing EV business would start with clean slate. Farley was quoted describing the EV sales model as: > "It's going to be much more efficie…

Excuse my ignorance, but how I understand is that ICE can't be sold directly to the customers, so that's why dealerships exists (?), so my question is, are EV not regulated or treated differently than ICE?

EV are regulated also. See for example Tesla's trouble selling directly to customers in some states.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_US_dealership_disputes

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#452
post #369
post #351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m skeptical that this reorg will allow Ford to sell direct to consumers, and I haven’t seen any reporting saying that it will. Notably, Ford has explicitly said they’re not doing that: “We’re not keeping dealers in the mix 'for the moment.' We are betting on dealers for the long term. I want to make that really clear. I’m not mincing words. We will have new standards and a new experience. But we learned a lot by wa…

> Maybe going direct is the secret plan, but I don’t see how they get there. Yeah, the dealership and the state level dealership associations aren't going to go out of business without some good fight. Even though I personally don't like the markup to be paid at the dealerships, but they exist for some good reasons: educate the consumers, financing, DMV paperwork and most importantly service your vehicles. EVs need m…

- educate the consumer

The last two cars I bought the salesperson knew nothing about the cars. People can learn much more about cars by going to a web site than talking to a sales person.

- DMV Paperwork

Dealerships charge consumers for the privilege of submitting DMV paperwork. This could all be handled online. Don’t understand the benefit.

- service your vehicle

I go to independent mechanics. They service my vehicle just fine.

Dealerships have got to go. They’re a huge waste of time space and money. They reflect crony capitalism at its worst.

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#453

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm under the impression that the service part of the dealership _is_ the profitable part If you drive a Ford, sure, it needs a lot of service. Which is why I stopped buying Ford. Toyota and Honda don’t need much service, and I don’t see how they are money makers for the dealer. And when you move to EV, you need even less service than before since the is no ICE to maintain.

I have a 19 year old Ford Focus that has been great. It's not much on creature comforts but it starts and runs like new. I've had two Hondas of the same vintage with dead transmissions.

It’s a shame those early 2000s automatic transmissions were junk. I’ve owned a few of them myself and it’s part of the territory. They got a lot better around 2012 but the damage was done.

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#454
post #417

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> educate the consumers, financing, DMV paperwork and most importantly service your vehicles. I bought a new car direct and I was educated, my credit union was better than the manufacturer's financing offer, the manufacturer did DMV paperwork, and the manufacturer does service. 9 years ago. What am I missing?

Memorial day Madness and wacky waving inflatable arm-flailing tube men?

Free hot dogs?

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#455
post #369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Maybe going direct is the secret plan, but I don’t see how they get there. Yeah, the dealership and the state level dealership associations aren't going to go out of business without some good fight. Even though I personally don't like the markup to be paid at the dealerships, but they exist for some good reasons: educate the consumers, financing, DMV paperwork and most importantly service your vehicles. EVs need m…

>> educate the consumers Every dealership I've been to has been more interested in feeding me whatever line of crap they think will get me to buy a car, not actually educating me about the different products available. >> financing, DMV paperwork Tesla and Carvana have proven these can be taken care of without a third party dealership. In most cases, financing is provided by a bank or credit union, not the dealership…

I had a dealership quote me $2600 for a required service package. The price of the parts was $400. It’s a bit of work but the labor was effectively over $366 per hour. I could have had the job done by an independent shop for $1000. When I pushed back, the service manager said he could do it for $1500.

I have a recall repair on the car as well so I think my final move is to use that as leverage to push the price down further. Getting the repair done by the dealer gets you a warranty by the manufacturer, which is the only additional value that I see.

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#456
post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Specifically says not including tires in the Twitter post.

Excluding the most expensive wear items is misleading though.

Buying new tires and balancing them can be done in a tire shop, no dealership needed?

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#457

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've known people who work at Best Buy and they get their products substantially cheaper, just as the online retailers do. There is some level of bake in for storing it at the store... but not really much different from sitting in an amazon warehouse for instance, most best buys have large warehouses in the back you'd never be aware of. Many people aren't aware of the price matching nor take advantage of it, they als…

Best Butt is basically a group of warehouses across the country - order from them online and you may find your order shipped from random Beat Buy stores. And for many of their products they all sell at MSRP anyway (apple laptops say) so they’re already matching Amazon et Al. And things like hdmi cables are some off brand and so they don’t price match anyway. They have a pretty slick setup going, also jumped in on the…

Best butt, hehe.

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#458

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> dealership interests aren’t aligned with EV manufacturers. There’s very little service revenue Citation needed. Both my EVs and ICEs needed similar amount of service. Breakage of drive trains are super rare nowadays (expect for over engineered performance stuff and just broken designs), same as breakages of batteries (cough, Bolt, cough). All stuff my cars needed a service for in last 20 years were comfort features…

> Citation needed. https://www.motortrend.com/news/government-ev-ice-maintenanc... https://www.consumerreports.org/car-repair-maintenance/pay-l... https://www.energy.gov/eere/vehicles/articles/fotw-1190-june... https://insideevs.com/news/527165/study-evs-ownership-40perc... https://publications.anl.gov/anlpubs/2021/05/167399.pdf

These are very high quality sources, thank you.

The best citation on this site.

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#459
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>That being said, is there any counterpoint to this view? Are there any benefits that dealerships offer today over direct sales? the only thing I can think to say is that they are still a convenient repair facility, Tesla is fairly notorious for slow turn-around for repair.[0] I think a nice middle-ground would be the conversion of dealerships into showrooms/receiving-centers/repair facilities -- oust the sales porti…

All manufacturers can suffer from poor repair times, not only Tesla. Especially these days. I waited six months for a brake booster replacement in my Audi SQ5 as it sat in the service center. They did give me a loaner the whole time though...

Tesla had very poor repair times even before the supply chain issues, much worse than other makes.

Re: Ford CEO says EVs will be sold 100% online with nonnegotiable price

#460
post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not a problem now, it will be a problem when you can easily get a Ford direct at MSRP but you have to pay dealer markup for a Chevy.

"...We've got to go to non-negotiated price..." Who's to say Ford can't "markup" either? To me that's exactly what it is...non-negotiated. If the dealer can sell a Mach-E for $5k above MSRP, Ford is leaving money on the table. Ford can bump up their non-negotiated price just as much. Why not? What are you going to do, go to another dealership and negotiate?

It’s like any other system. A middle man has to take their cut and will increase costs. There is no reason (that I know of) to think the dealership model would ever decrease costs.
Post reply on HN