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Cannabis use produces persistent cognitive impairments: meta review

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Re: Cannabis use produces persistent cognitive impairments: meta review

#451

Post by Mezzie »

llamajams wrote: post #389

I went from an occasional social user to a habitual personal user...because COVID and staying at home were killing me. And it actually doubled my productivity. But eventually got to the point where I HAD to smoke to perform, and definitely had a way worse sober baseline after a year of persistent use. So I stopped. Regret having gone down that path =(.

I also went really hard this last year and am currently pulling back on my usage. I don't regret it. Now I know what all the danger signs are and I can recognize them in the future.

Re: Cannabis use produces persistent cognitive impairments: meta review

#452

Post by Mezzie »

eddyerburgh wrote: post #60
fshbbdssbbgdd wrote: post #4

My personal experience certainly agrees with this. I definitely shouldn’t smoke on a work night, and it’s not a good idea on Sunday either. The more hours until I need to perform cognitively, the better. I abstained for months before the last time I did job interviews. On the other hand, I know people also gainfully employed at top companies who code while high and claim to have no issues. Your mileage may vary, I gu…

So why smoke at all? Don’t you want to operate in life at your cognitive best?

In my case, I use drugs because I have MS and if I didn't, the only signals I ever get from my body are constant pain.

Some occasional drug use reminds me that my body doesn't exist solely to hurt me, that I can still experience pleasure, and that it's still worth trying to find things I might like/be able to enjoy since many of my previous physical pleasures aren't possible or are less enjoyable than they used to be. Without them, my physical existence is only pain, and that's depressing. Being depressed is way worse on my cognitive abilities than doing drugs once in a while.

This is true for most people who use regularly: The drugs are a harm-reduction measure. If weed fucks you up (-10 cognitive ability) but also gets rid of your anxiety (-20 cognitive ability), it's still a net win.

Re: Cannabis use produces persistent cognitive impairments: meta review

#453

Post by Mezzie »

Broken_Hippo wrote: post #141
eddyerburgh wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So why smoke at all? Don’t you want to operate in life at your cognitive best?

Don’t you want to operate in life at your cognitive best I'm over 40 and have worked crap jobs most of my life. It isn't like my increasing my cognitive abilities being "best" - whatever the heck that actually means - is going to make a huge difference in my life. To tell you the truth, I'm much more worried about cognitive decline as a side effect of MS than I am the effects of getting high. It isn't like it makes m…

Another MSer here and weed has never made me bang my head on the table because I kept mixing up words during the last meeting. That's all MS.

Re: Cannabis use produces persistent cognitive impairments: meta review

#454

Post by cthalupa »

sexy_panda wrote: post #445
cthalupa wrote: post #431

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It is still a challenge, but I know i'm not the only high functioning cannabis user. There are plenty of people that are highly functioning and regular smokers of pot that don't go through this level of ceremony about their usage, and I am somewhat skeptical this level of preparation is even particularly helpful in making someone a high functioning cannabis user in general. Not saying it doesn't work for you, but th…

It's the same as with other drugs, set and setting really change the quality of the overall experience. Preparation is usually important to have a good time. e.g. I clean up my apartment, buy groceries, do anything that needs to be done. This is sort of what gets me high already. It's a success and smoking after having everything done is a blast. My head is empty and I have nothing on my mind. The perfect mix to real…

I don't disagree that set and setting will impact things, but this isn't really being presented as a "If I do these things I am more likely to enjoy the experience", but rather as "I have to do all of these challenging things to make the experience one that meaningful and otherwise it's just a stoner getting a stoned, but this challenge is what makes me a high functioning user of marijuana"

To me, it's the distinction between "being stoned" and "virtuous pot smoking" and the connection being made between the latter being something that "high functioning cannabis users" do.

Lots of people just get stoned. That isn't what makes them high functioning or not - it's whether that impacts their ability to have a productive and fulfilling life. For me, and the many people I know that are regular users, the answer is not really. I imagine there are likely some trade offs, but I and the people I know have good careers, fulfilling personal lives, and do it because we enjoy it, the same way I partake in other hobbies I enjoy.

Re: Cannabis use produces persistent cognitive impairments: meta review

#455

Post by llamajams »

Mezzie wrote: post #451
llamajams wrote: post #389

I went from an occasional social user to a habitual personal user...because COVID and staying at home were killing me. And it actually doubled my productivity. But eventually got to the point where I HAD to smoke to perform, and definitely had a way worse sober baseline after a year of persistent use. So I stopped. Regret having gone down that path =(.

I also went really hard this last year and am currently pulling back on my usage. I don't regret it. Now I know what all the danger signs are and I can recognize them in the future.

Thats awesom, i wish i had just kept smoking for pleasure instead of work. I think the daytime smoking messed me up...just felt really stupid and unmotivated in the end. The last straw was when I waked and baked and went to a meeting with leadership.

Re: Cannabis use produces persistent cognitive impairments: meta review

#456

Post by lm28469 »

symlinkk wrote: post #387
mathieuh wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who was physically dependent on benzos, heroin, and speed, you 100% can get addicted to cannabis. I wouldn't say it was any easier to quit for me than any other drug. The experience was different but the effects on my life were broadly similar. If not addiction, what would you call spending money, time and health you can't afford on something? I only managed to quit about five months ago and I've already l…

You cannot get physically addicted to weed. You will never have withdrawals from quitting weed like you do with alcohol or heroin. Perhaps you can get mentally addicted to it but that applies to literally anything.

2 seconds of google search seems to prove the opposite... I don't think anyone is implying it's comparable to heroin.

Re: Cannabis use produces persistent cognitive impairments: meta review

#457

Post by tata71 »

bjourne wrote: post #403
otherme123 wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of drugs make you more social, but sadly they are all outlawed except alcohol. MDMA was used for years to lubricate psicotherapy sessions, until the FDA found out that some people was having "too much fun", banned the thing, and denied it has any possible positive effect. Only two years ago it seems that it is going to be reseached again. Thomas Szasz has some books about drug history and the paths that turns a…

How can otherwise intelligent people believe drugs are outlawed because people were having too much fun?

Did you note that the GP wrote it in quotes?

Re: Cannabis use produces persistent cognitive impairments: meta review

#458

Post by zepto »

ganzuul wrote: post #402
TriNetra wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A persistent high can be achieved by living mindfully with kindness and regular meditation (speaking from direct experience). Hence, I'm not surprised that any high induced with a substance instead, impairs the brain as brain starts depending on the induced experience, without having developed its own mechanism to have such an experience.

Many people, especially the young, can not find a peaceful time or place for meditation. The demands placed on them by western society take up too much of their energy. For them, drugs are a must because otherwise they will grow up without any spiritual life at all.

This is just false. Just spend 15 minutes less per day on video games or doomscrolling.

Re: Cannabis use produces persistent cognitive impairments: meta review

#459

Post by tagoregrtst »

cthalupa wrote: post #438
tagoregrtst wrote: post #426

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He became a heroin addict after his suicide attempt, after he crashed out of band camp, after he smoked his ambition to be a goos drummer away.

> after he smoked his ambition to be a goos drummer away. This is the part that doesn't follow. We have no actual indication that smoking pot had anything to do with his lack/loss of ambition. I could give plenty of anecdotal studies where people became complacent because they got a promotion, or made it to a certain landmark, or realized that they were the smartest person in the room at the time, or a million other…

“ This is the part that doesn't follow.”

This is what follows, or at least strongly implied, from OP’s post;

“ My friend spent the whole year smoking marijuana and being complacent”

We can only argue from what is in the story. Not what is not in it or what we’d rather wasn’t.

The OP shared a story, admitting its anecdotal.

Re: Cannabis use produces persistent cognitive impairments: meta review

#460

Post by picklesman »

dr_dshiv wrote: post #346
irjustin wrote: post #14

Since the article and the study are light on the details of "persistent" Here's the supporting data's in a bit more detail[0]. Overall this makes sense to me as an individually who personally enjoys it. The whole point of getting high is to be impaired (for me). So it's not really telling me anything new. Like drinking, I can't expect myself to be 100% functioning the next day so plan accordingly. The question is how…

Wow, impairment is not my intention at all. But, to not impair myself takes careful moderation and preparation. For cognitive benefits or "virtuous pot smoking", I need to have exercise, sleep, right intentions, a clean room and music. If I do it right, I have transformational ideas. If I don't write them down, they are gone. The first hour is often a wash. I expect little. I often combine with coffee. Then, after an…

I recently started infusing my own oils to then use sublingually for similar reasons and it's been a revelation!

You can know pretty much exactly how much THC you're getting and adjust / repeat as necessary. I haven't smoked in years but I've been vaping (with a Pax) for the past couple of years and attempted to "microdose" but it was very unpredictable and sometimes I would get higher than I wanted which is not good when using it for "work" purposes (programming, music, video editing, etc).

I've also recently come to the conclusion that for me, Cannabis definitely falls into the "less is more" category, and I limit regular doses (ie vaping to get high) to once a week. I can use the oils multiple times (at doses of roughly 5mg) to get into the zone without negative consequences.

When I overdo it with vaping I have the usual issues with forgetfulness (struggle to find words etc) and my motivation definitely takes a hit. Also I've found that tolerance grows very fast the more you use it and it becomes quite unpredictable.

Oh and for me it helps to mix it with a bit of caffeine as well. Slightly off topic but as someone sensitive to caffeine, the perfect "delivery mechanism" for me is a small shot of espresso in the morning and then a whole bunch of Sencha the rest of the day. Calm focus and good mood and still able to fall asleep :)

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