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The unnecessary demise of Barnes and Noble

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Re: The unnecessary demise of Barnes and Noble

#451
post #6

I was out shopping 3-4 days before Christmas this year, and happened to be near a Barnes and Noble so figured I'd grab a copy of a magazine I've been wanting to read for a while. Grabbed the magazine, wandered the aisles a bit and picked up another book then went to check out. Basically I was their marketing department's dream - walk-in traffic coming to buy something cheap and specific who made an impulse retail buy…

Even worse. I wasn't able to buy online from them. My credit card charge was declined (two different cards). I contacted the Card bank and they said that it is B&N that cancelled the sale.

I contacted B&N support and they gave me a response that it is due to their fraud detection service. There was no solution to buy. They didn't offer PayPal or another gateway. So I had to walk away.

Re: The unnecessary demise of Barnes and Noble

#452

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing is Steve Jobs was taking a $1 salary. Even if you can find a great CEO with a great plan with your company, I don't think paying him 10M$ instead of 500k will make him more efficient or be necessary to retain him. Also I don't think the CEOs salaries are a results of competition for the best (like tech workers), but CEO being generous with themselves (and their peers as they're all in each others' board).

Jobs demanded a $40 MM private jet and large equity increases from the board.

I'm pretty sure he was well compensated, but still - the success he had at Apple was not a consequence of his compensation.

And I don't think he was more expensive than the previous Apple CEO (Gil Amelio?) or any alternative they had at the time.

Re: The unnecessary demise of Barnes and Noble

#453
post #442
post #416

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Haha, you literally just came upon This breaks the HN guidelines in two ways. First, it's uncivil. Second, it falls far short of this: "Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize." Could you please read https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and follow those rules when commenting here? It does take an effort, but it's an effor…

> This breaks the HN guidelines in two ways. First, it's uncivil. Did you read my other responses because I 100% agree with him. I was just laughing because he made a textbook economic argument but didn't actually mention economics. > "Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize." What? I am 100% in agreement with OP. What argument do you…

Possibly I misunderstood you, in which case I'm sorry. We often have to guess at what people meant in their comments. On the other hand, we're no different from other readers in that respect, so if I guessed wrong, almost certainly others did too.

Re: The unnecessary demise of Barnes and Noble

#454
Did retail ever deserve to live anyway? What kind of life and satisfaction does one get by selling someone else's work? It's easy, low skill and is just plain 'busy work'. Perhaps we are entering the golden age where one's worth is more closely related to the value they add to other peoples lives through their real work as human beings - not as middle men (middle people?) The trades for example are thriving. The food industry is burgeoning. Tourism is growing.Good riddance to mind numbing dehumanizing work - the assembly line, the stock clerk, the delivery person.

Re: The unnecessary demise of Barnes and Noble

#455
post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think we are pretty far from truly replacing truck drivers. There will be a long period where the truck driver is in the car but not really driving, maybe even a very long time depending on if it is enshrined in law. Even if the truck did drive itself, would it also load/unload and deal with flat tires and other vehicle damage conditions? I don't think these problems are insurmountable but I do think they will furt…

I think that replacing long-haul drivers will happen sooner than you think. Self-driving (though human monitored) trucks are already operating: https://www.wired.com/story/embark-self-driving-truck-delive... I think the first step will be replacing long-haul truck drivers with autonomous trucks, they'll start at a depo near a freeway and end at a depo at the other end, then a human will drive to make the local delive…

Why do you think it will be legal for a truck to operate without a driver anytime soon?

I mean that is possible but I'm skeptical about us being that shortsighted with so many jobs on the line.

Re: The unnecessary demise of Barnes and Noble

#456
post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlike the Internet, when a break-and-mortar fails it's not easy for a competitor to break into the space and scoop up their market share. In theory in an efficient market, players that deserve to fail will be replaced and the market as a whole will remain and become stronger. In meatspace, where many things have friction, players that deserve to fail will bring the market down. I also wish it weren't the case, but i…

> Unlike the Internet, when a break-and-mortar fails it's not easy for a competitor to break into the space and scoop up their market share. Also, in this space, there's a competitor that's on it's way to a monopoly. if B&N goes belly-up, I'm not even sure where I could buy books besides Amazon.

Try powells.com, an independent but pretty comprehensive bookstore in Portland.

Re: The unnecessary demise of Barnes and Noble

#457
post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yes, tons of jobs are going away (although I think it'll be 10-20 years for most of these, not 3-5 years like many seem to think), but what new sectors, opportunities, jobs, etc. will be created? How many of the people whose jobs are destroyed will be able to move into the jobs that are created? In something like 30 states [0] 'truck driver' is the largest single occupation; where would those skills be re-applied?…

You may be right, I don't know. I'm not saying we shouldn't worry about this, just that I'm personally skeptical, and not really in favor of restructuring society for a problem that might be coming. If we had done that all those times in the past... To take the truck driver thing, here's a plausible scenario (to me anyway). First of all, "top job in X states" seems like a really weird way to express this. It honestly…

The other stat I think is relevant is that the average car today is 11.5 years old. Or looked at another way, in 11 years, HALF of the cars on the road are the cars that are on the road today. I guess if we cut down the number of cars total due to efficiencies of self-driving carshare maybe that goes down but still... If Level 5 autonomous drive were available TODAY, it's still a long metaphoric road towards complete switchover.

It's hard to tell what the average tractor age is, but it looks between 6 and 10 years old so you have the same rough math in the 6-10 years after we have fully autonomous self-driving trucks where we'll still have half the trucks on the road as human-driven.

Plus if autonomous trucks increase capacity and/or efficiency and cut shipping costs, that might also stimulate shipping demand and therefore keep human drivers on the road longer as well.

Your 10-20 years guess feels right to me, but only after we actually have the autonomous truck thing fully sorted out, IMO.

Re: The unnecessary demise of Barnes and Noble

#458
post #354

My wife has worked for B&N for 21 years. I met her there, and worked there for a bit over a year. I've followed this company since then, and the amount of sheer stupidity exhibited by upper management is astounding. Decisions from the regional and main corporate offices that were just amateurish. Money wasted, time wasted, people wasted. I'm amazed they've lasted this long.

Any examples?

Around 2000-2002, you could walk into most B&N stores and find nice comfortable chairs to sit in. These chairs encouraged book lovers to grab a book, sit down, read a few pages, and actually enjoy the book buying experience. So what did B&N do over the next couple of years? Get rid of the comfortable chairs, and replace them on a 1:2 basis with hard, uncomfortable wooden chairs. Then slowly phase these chairs out completely.

This did a couple of things; discourage people from reading books on the book floor, while encouraging them to read in the Cafe, where the books and magazines get damaged easily. But the core idea of having an inviting bookstore died that year.

Another issue was the Cafe relationship with Starbucks. The Cafe's use Starbucks components, and often follow their recipes. They have tons of "Starbucks" branding as part of this relationship. BUT you can't use a Starbuck giftcard at a B&N Cafe. Try explaining this to someone who received a giftcard over the holidays. They order a coffee after waiting in line, and get hassled about the form of payment. It wouldn't have been hard for B&N management to work out a deal with Starbucks for handling these cards, but B&N never did.

Also, bookstores have the ability to send a majority of their inventory back to the publisher (yeah, crazy legacy stuff). Inventory levels are largely decided by Corp HQ yet despite modern inventory mgmt software being a thing, they continually botched it. So you would get huge shipments. Then when cash flow for the company would get tight, they'd have you pull the books off the shelves and send them back to the publishers. This would be a continual process that consumes tons of time, time that would be better spent on customer service.

Corp HQ would also decide to change the store layout frequently. The staff would pack up all the Sci-Fi/Fantasy books, move them to a completely different part of the store. Customers would come in, head to their favorite section, and be flummoxed. Since so many labor hours were spent doing this type of thing, (and the aforementioned book pulls), there weren't as many employees on the book floor to help. I called it the Titanic chair shuffling...

Staffing levels were always a problem. On busy holiday weeknights, you might have 4-5 people working. One manager, one head cashier, two in the cafe, and one on the book floor. Employees need breaks, so often you would end up with one cashier, and one person on the book floor. If you get a rush of people, that line at the register can get awfully long. B&N only pays lip service to the customer experience.

A lot of these types of decisions add up overtime to create a crappy customer experience. B&N never could compete with Amazon on pricing, and never should have. They should have embraced the book buying experience, and made customers love coming in. But that's a long long game to play, and their management made continually bad choices (like Nook) that distracted them, took capital they didn't have, and confused customers.

Re: The unnecessary demise of Barnes and Noble

#459

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do understand why. You know that people won't work as much. Will disengage. Will cause trouble and cost you money, time, efforts. This is resources consumed. Some companies value saving resources over human decencies. This is magnified when there is crisis and resources are in shorter supply than before. There is no mystery to it, no complexity to it.

But I'm not suggesting they tell everyone the company is in dire straits and they are on the verge of getting fired. Just don't willfully lie to them on a daily basis and tell them that things are amazing and their jobs are totally secure. In my scenario, we weren't actively asking questions regularly. But they were offering the (mis)information on an almost daily basis.

The minute they leak that there are layoffs coming, every talented individual is going to start spending all their time job hunting instead of working even if they weren't going to be laid off; likewise, untalented individuals will stop giving a shit. You also have security problems if you provide advanced notice. It is inevitable that the data will get leaked which will affect share price before a narrative can be composed, you give vindictive employees time to steal IP, data, or physical goods before they are out the door, and you provide a window of time for people to damage systems.

Unfortunately the best way to do it from the company's perspective is to be sudden and surgical, giving people 0 time to sabotage the company.

Re: The unnecessary demise of Barnes and Noble

#460
post #458

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any examples?

Around 2000-2002, you could walk into most B&N stores and find nice comfortable chairs to sit in. These chairs encouraged book lovers to grab a book, sit down, read a few pages, and actually enjoy the book buying experience. So what did B&N do over the next couple of years? Get rid of the comfortable chairs, and replace them on a 1:2 basis with hard, uncomfortable wooden chairs. Then slowly phase these chairs out com…

Thank you for such a detailed response!
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