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Firefox 57.0 Released

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Re: Firefox 57.0 Released

#451

Post by iterati »

chimeracoder wrote: post #353
iterati wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

electrovim is in no way a replacement for Vimperator. It's a couple of keyboard shortcuts. None of the current vim-like plugins for FF57 match what vimperator/pentadactyl can do. The problem I have isn't that they broke legacy things, it's that they broke legacy things without offering a path to rebuild them.

> electrovim is in no way a replacement for Vimperator. It's a couple of keyboard shortcuts. None of the current vim-like plugins for FF57 match what vimperator/pentadactyl can do. Uh, yes, I'm the author of Electrovim, so I'm quite aware of the functionality that I was literally unable to implement because no equivalent API existed. > The problem I have isn't that they broke legacy things, it's that they broke legac…

> I've developed a couple of Firefox extensions. One of those was an e10s-compatible replacement for Vimperator, because Vimperator relied on XUL[0].

Replacement for Vimperator implies it's, well, a replacement for Vimperator.

> Did you not read the rest of the comment, where I explain why there is no feasible way that they could have offered any path to rebuild them?

I don't see how your addressed that. Yes, existing extensions that used XUL would have to be rewritten using new APIs. My issue is that those APIs don't even exist. That there are good reasons the old APIs aren't available anymore doesn't address the lack of new APIs that offer anything near equivalent functionality.

Re: Firefox 57.0 Released

#452

Post by throwanem »

chimeracoder wrote: post #353
iterati wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

electrovim is in no way a replacement for Vimperator. It's a couple of keyboard shortcuts. None of the current vim-like plugins for FF57 match what vimperator/pentadactyl can do. The problem I have isn't that they broke legacy things, it's that they broke legacy things without offering a path to rebuild them.

> electrovim is in no way a replacement for Vimperator. It's a couple of keyboard shortcuts. None of the current vim-like plugins for FF57 match what vimperator/pentadactyl can do. Uh, yes, I'm the author of Electrovim, so I'm quite aware of the functionality that I was literally unable to implement because no equivalent API existed. > The problem I have isn't that they broke legacy things, it's that they broke legac…

Is it impossible to support window or otherwise chrome-level event listeners and also e10s? As I said in a prior comment, there seems no a priori reason that should be the case.

Re: Firefox 57.0 Released

#453

Post by SAI_Peregrinus »

KozmoNau7 wrote: post #66
IChrisI wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tree Style Tabs was the only blocker for me, and I was amazed that it was possible to recreate under the new API. I use both Firefox and Chrome, but for very different purposes. In Chrome, I have 20-50 tabs spread across two windows. In Firefox, 400+. Tree Style Tabs is necessary for how I use Firefox. My backup plan was staying on an older version, possibly indefinitely.

400 tabs? 400 ? I'm sorry if I sound a little condescending, but have you considered using bookmarks instead? I cannot even imagine a workflow where four flippin' hundred active tabs are needed.

Bookmarks have a really, really bad interface compared to tab trees.

Bookmarks are flat by default. You can make folders, but that takes manually opening the bookmarks manager and placing newly created bookmarks into the appropriate folder. Folders also waste space in the tree; one bookmark can't directly be the parent of another. The web doesn't have folders, it has links.

Bookmarks don't preserve structural context the way tab trees do. For example when using an API documentation site I'll open the site in a window, and from there open classes I need info on in tabs. Methods or related classes go in sub-tabs. I eventually end up with tabs for all the bits of the API I need to reference AND THE STRUCTURE!

Bookmarks are also hidden behind a menu, and are slow to access. Tabs can simply be suspended to save resources, and their trees collapsed.

Etc, etc. Bookmarks have horrible UX compared to tab trees.

Re: Firefox 57.0 Released

#454

Post by Yoric »

Silhouette wrote: post #415
Yoric wrote: post #402

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can understand your point of view. I believe that better security, performance and privacy is worth the partial (and hopefully mostly momentary) loss of customization, but YMMV.

I hope time will prove you right. FWIW, Firefox 57 is currently looking like a net loss in terms of security and privacy. A significant number of the extensions people have previously used for blocking or restricting potentially intrusive or dangerous behaviours seem to have been lost, in some cases without equivalent WebExtension alternatives being available. If you're arguing that 57 is now more secure and better f…

> FWIW, Firefox 57 is currently looking like a net loss in terms of security and privacy. A significant number of the extensions people have previously used for blocking or restricting potentially intrusive or dangerous behaviours seem to have been lost, in some cases without equivalent WebExtension alternatives being available.

First, I'd like to put things in context. When you write "Firefox 57 is currently looking like a net loss in terms of security and privacy", I suppose that this might (arguably) be true for you and a few other power users, but for the ~100% of users who do not use these power add-ons, their life will only be improved by the change.

Plus, I actually think that all the add-ons in the domain either have been ported or have an equivalent that has been ported. Certainly all the ones I use have been. Am I missing something that people actually use for their protection?

> If you're arguing that 57 is now more secure and better for privacy, perhaps you know something that people like me don't, and if so, maybe it's worth highlighting whatever built-in functionality can now replace those protections more in the documentation/marketing?

There is only so much message that marketing can propagate in a single campaign. I expect that we'll have another marketing campaign in a few months detailing what we've been doing for security and privacy. Especially since we'll have exciting stuff to showcase :)

Let me give you a few keywords of stuff we've been doing to improve security: a gazillion fixes, better static analysis, replacing some critical components with Rust, introducing the first formally proved implementation of cryptography components in a browser, sandbox improvements, etc.

On privacy, I'll admit haven't really paid attention, but the new add-ons you install don't have access to your private data without your consent, I remember that we've been working working with Tor Browser to reduce fingerprinting, etc.

Re: Firefox 57.0 Released

#455

Post by Oishikatta »

trendia wrote: post #354
Sylos wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their privacy statement is pretty clear. That's a legally binding document and lying in that will get you pretty high fines even in the US.

Netflix was sued because they kept rental history on former customers. Netflix revenue: $8,800,000,000 Lawsuit amount: $9,000,000 (or approx 0.1%) Lawyers received: $2,100,000 Plaintiffs received: $30,000 [0] https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2012/07/class-action-law...

You can't compare to revenue, that makes no sense.

Netflix's global net income in 2012 was apparently $17 million.

A $9 million fine is then over half of their annual income.

[0] https://www.scribd.com/mobile/document/121853053/Netflix-4Q-...

Re: Firefox 57.0 Released

#456

Post by petre »

Where do I see the params of post requests in the developer tools? The parameters tab only shows url params. The old behaviour was to show both. Also, rendering a 50k json response is slow.

Re: Firefox 57.0 Released

#457

Post by Yoric »

manojlds wrote: post #441
parmesan wrote: post #116

I just updated - WOW! What an improvement! Compared startup time and scrolling around some over-monetized sites; Behaves just as well as Chrome. Time for a switch again, I've missed FireFox since I started having Chrome as my default browser back in ~2011

If it as just as good as chrome, why should I switch? Especially given how good Chrome Dev tools are.

Better privacy? Non-profit? More open source? Cheerful community? Pick one or more :)

Re: Firefox 57.0 Released

#459

Post by chc »

rodorgas wrote: post #319
seanalltogether wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a bit annoyed by the dark header bar now, they previously only used that for private windows, now it appears they use it for both.

Firefox never made that distinction. What you describe is a Chrome beaviour. I think it'd be better if Mozilla copied it.

Yeah, Firefox on desktop has always just had a badge on private windows, with everything else being the same. I think mobile uses different colors, though.

Re: Firefox 57.0 Released

#460

Post by Mizza »

msla wrote: post #323
Mizza wrote: post #65

I just upgraded. It completely changes the chrome of the browser on OSX and it is _absolutely hideous_. There are a lots of unnecessary animations that I find very jarring. I don't know if there's a way to change it back yet. UPDATE: There is a "Customize Firefox" button which allows modifying the theme, which fixes the colors, but not the shape of the tabs or the animations. UPDATE: In about:config, you can disable…

And it's impossible to put the tabs beneath the address bar, or to have actual toolbars. Decades of UI/UX knowledge, down the drain. Usability is gone.

I've found a way to move the tabs below the address bar here: https://github.com/Isaac-Newt/userChrome-styles
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