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New statue in London, attributed to Banksy, of a suited man, blinded by a flag

smithsonianmag.com

441–450 of 615 posts

Re: New statue in London, attributed to Banksy, of a suited man, blinded by a flag

#441
post #417

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what is Avon? Welsh for river.

Hah TIL. So it's the river Welsh river on the English side of the Bristol channel. I often feel like I would understand a lot more names if I bothered learning Welsh. It's pretty popular for made up climbing route names too, because Wales is so good for it I guess. Allegedly some of the classics in the Avon gorge are Welsh derived but I could never figure them out to be sure.

They're more likely Celtic words that live on in Welsh.

Re: New statue in London, attributed to Banksy, of a suited man, blinded by a flag

#442

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had to check your other comments and now I get it that you still regard flags as having some sacred meaning in the great national past, but for me they always were about gathering as much human expendables underneath. Sure, they might have had generated enough sacred reverence, those bloodbaths of past.

> you still regard flags as having some sacred meaning I would like to disagree on this point.

Sorry if I got you wrong!

Re: New statue in London, attributed to Banksy, of a suited man, blinded by a flag

#443
post #128

Things were more fun when they were actually transgressive and not just the established doctrine of those in power.

Yeah. The safety of the message is underwritten by its state sanction.

In what way is this statue state sanctioned?

Re: New statue in London, attributed to Banksy, of a suited man, blinded by a flag

#444

Banksy is the patron saint of the “I’m 13 and this is deep” mentality.

Heaven forbid someone tries to communicate a point with art.

He wasn't objecting to that. He was saying the "point" is about as sophisticated as "we should just, like, all agree not to fight wars man".

Personally I don't mind it. I think it would be difficult to convey well thought out points in art (the world is too complicated) and it's fine that they're just fun visual wordplays.

You wouldn't criticise a newspaper political cartoon for taking liberties with reality; these are basically the same.

Re: New statue in London, attributed to Banksy, of a suited man, blinded by a flag

#445

Banksy is the patron saint of the “I’m 13 and this is deep” mentality.

I disagree. There's plenty of adults going around plastering England's St George Cross flag on lampposts to project their love of the flag (along with the not so subtle messaging that immigrants and anyone non-white aren't welcome). If adults are going to behave like adolescents, then the art needs to go to their level.

(I'm a fan of Banksy because he isn't afraid to speak out against the blatant murder carried out because of flags and nationalism)

Re: New statue in London, attributed to Banksy, of a suited man, blinded by a flag

#446

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it? Most people I know who have flags proudly displayed are left wing and their flags are usually one of: the Palestinian flag, the ukrainian flag, the LGBT rainbow flag, or the trans flag.

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(What you call an "objective fact" here is - as you say - your report of your personal experience. Everyone else would probably use a word more like "subjective".)

Re: New statue in London, attributed to Banksy, of a suited man, blinded by a flag

#447
post #383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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I think that kind of pride is pointless and unproductive. I think it is right to be grateful to your ancestors for their achievements in ultimately giving you the life that you have. But proud? Hubris lies down that path. Re: luck, yes, it is absolutely luck that you were born to the parents you were born to, located in the place you were born in. I think you have the sense of the luck direction flipped from what GP…

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Re: New statue in London, attributed to Banksy, of a suited man, blinded by a flag

#448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, that's true, if you completely ignore the reality of how they're used in practice today

Every parish church in England (more or less) has flown the St. George's cross traditionally for as long as I can remember. There is nothing wrong with that. Conversely, Union Jacks are a major symbol of Loyalism and Orangeism in Ireland, and parts of Scotland, which is an extremely aggressive and "hands on" movement. Union Jacks can be seen in pictures of every far right movement going back a century or more. The Un…

England has a unique position in the Union, and indeed much of the world, where it is seen as an historic and current oppressive force, and our attitude to flags has to acknowledge that context.

In Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland the Union Flag is a reminder that the UK countries are ultimately run by England, where there isn’t a true acknowledgement that the countries are culturally different, let alone able to rule themselves.

Within England the St George’s Cross has become a symbol of exceptionalism and superiority, not least because it is prominently flown on nationalist and supremacist marches. Since the Union Jack includes the other countries in the Union, use of St George is often seen as a snub to the other countries.

So England can’t win? No. Correctly so, IMO, because of history and context (I am English).

Re: New statue in London, attributed to Banksy, of a suited man, blinded by a flag

#449

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm pretty sure the piece is a commentary on the recent phenomenon of people of a right-wing political orientation hanging up the England flag everywhere , to the consternation of local governments who have to spend money taking them down. From a British perspective there's no ambiguity, flag shagging is a right-wing activity.

Every single left-wing march flies a lot of flags as well, only they are different flags. Political movements in general don't seem to be particularly immune to flag shagging , only the colors vary a lot. But I am pretty sure that Banksy means right-wing flag worship as well. He is a master of "provocative conformism" and wouldn't produce anything that would get him into a real risk of controversy. His art is very fi…

Choosing a traditionally suited man as the standard bearer adds a formal banality to the blindness (to my eyes).

Re: New statue in London, attributed to Banksy, of a suited man, blinded by a flag

#450
post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regional chauvinism is never good for a healthy union. Even if it were the Union Jack, flag-shaggers are almost always blood and soil zealots.

I disagree here. Local/regional chauvinism is funny and de-dramatize nationalism while being a very good point to start discussions. Seeing the Gwenn ah Du flag in the US or in other foreign country is basically a "come talk to me" call.

There are different sorts of regional chauvinism though: a distinction can be drawn between English flags erected in random US states by people who want to talk about their ancestors in the 1750s, English flags flown alongside the local coat of arms on tourist sites all over the UK, English flags hanging from English homes by all over England because of excitement for an upcoming football tournament and English flags surreptitiously hung on council property by far-right thugs who attack council staff tasked with removing them, on the basis of internet memes about needing more flags to show those immigrants who's boss. England has all of the above, but that last one has dominated flag erections recently.

As for Banksy who incidentally also likes making surreptitious additions to other people's property, he's never exactly been subtle about which school of politics he doesn't like

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