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Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

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Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#441

Post by ConceptJunkie »

tracker1 wrote: post #438
samus wrote: post #424

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's an unfair fear since architecturally Wine sits at the same position as the Win32 API on Windows, which also in the end merely uses the underlying native system calls. The only difference is that Linux aims to keep its system call interface stable.

You're saying that Windows' system interfaces aren't stable? In comparison to Linux?

win32 dates back to 1993. OP doesn't know Windows history. Maintaining backwards compatibility was always a huge priority for Microsoft, even if it couldn't be perfect.

If a program didn't work on a newer version of Windows, there's a good chance it was doing something unsupported.

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#442

Post by samus »

tracker1 wrote: post #438
samus wrote: post #424

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's an unfair fear since architecturally Wine sits at the same position as the Win32 API on Windows, which also in the end merely uses the underlying native system calls. The only difference is that Linux aims to keep its system call interface stable.

You're saying that Windows' system interfaces aren't stable? In comparison to Linux?

The API underneath the Win32 API, the Windows Native API, is not necessarily stable and therefore not intended for direct consumption by applications.

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#443

Post by IIsi50MHz »

pier25 wrote: post #91
adelmotsjr wrote: post #5

Reading these posts always make me feel like an imposter. People are dealing with such low level things, while i'm outta here building simple CRUDs.

Same. I feel like a plumber compared to real engineers.

Engineers & architects leave a lot of detail out of their designs, relying on the plumbers and other trades to figure out the Right Thing. (-:

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#444

Post by moralestapia »

moring wrote: post #432
moralestapia wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you have a Steam Wallet without having a credit card?

Yes, I do. It just means that you have to manually "recharge" your Steam wallet when it runs low. That's some effort, but it limits the possible damage if something goes wrong.

How do you "recharge" you Steam Wallet? Gift cards, I assume?

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#445

Post by Melatonic »

HWR_14 wrote: post #392
worthless-trash wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dont think you can even load the "windows" kernel module in wine. Last time i tried with the capcom rootkit, it didnt work at all.

I read the person I was responding to saying they avoided games with root kits for moral, not technical, reasons. So I assumed they were on Windows, and AFAIK, windows just offers binary "changes" permissions which covers anything from installing in the slightly protected Program Files directory to installing a rootkit. In other words, can they even detect they are about to install a root kit?

Good question and one I am now looking into

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#446

Post by guzfip »

samus wrote: post #431
guzfip wrote: post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They put him in a cubicle where he wrote Visual Basic CRUDs on an 8-5 schedule. No weird deadlines, no sleeping under the desk. He called it his paid vacation. That was all nice and good for a while, but the times are ending. I suspect there will still be a human involved in the production of software, but it will be domain experts, not CRUd monkeys who picked up just enough domain knowledge to be dangerous.

The really valuable CRUD monkeys are already domain experts as well. The threatened ones are junior developers whose output is barely better than AI slop.

> The really valuable CRUD monkeys are already domain experts as well

Sure but that’s a minority I’d argue. There wouldn’t be such a volume of shitty business software otherwise.

I will be interested to see if there are any economic effects of ending one of the last well paid, low barrier to entry careers in which some level of meritocracy was permitted.

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#447

Post by jackhalford »

I wonder if having a /dev/ntsync device could make it easier for game devs to compile their games for linux in the first place, instead of having to use wine. There may be other windows specific dependencies though, but this is one less right?

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#448

Post by Grimblewald »

ticulatedspline wrote: post #4

Wine might be oddly self-defeating. Broad game support on Linux increases the viability of Linux as a desktop, which increases market share, which may result in developers creating Linux ports as a 1st class concern, which don't need Wine to run.

Wine has always beem a bandage not a final thing. Something to drive exactly this transition to better. Through wine ive been able to transition many colleagues accross because software they need will work as they expect it to in linux and everything elese is an arcane mystery to them anyway. This means one less network effect contributing win user. Most also experience a massive jump in tech literacy as a result of the move, since a system that doesn't wall you out at every step lets you passively learn more.

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#449

Post by zerr »

guzfip wrote: post #389
Pannoniae wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah exactly. High-level people think the low-level stuff is magic, and us from the other side think the high-level stuff is magic (how can you handle all that complexity?...)

> how can you handle all that complexity?... You don’t. Someone else smarter than you handled it already and you just need to integrate their solution.

"Someone else smarter than you manufactured microchips and you just need to integrate their solutions."

Re: Wine 11 rewrites how Linux runs Windows games at kernel with massive speed gains

#450

Post by zerr »

Pannoniae wrote: post #342
zerr wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The grass is always greener on the other side - many low-level programmers feel like an imposter when it comes to high-level systems such as CRUD apps.

Yeah exactly. High-level people think the low-level stuff is magic, and us from the other side think the high-level stuff is magic (how can you handle all that complexity?...)

Yup. AbstractSingletonProxyFactoryBean and SimpleBeanFactoryAwareAspectInstanceFactory agree as well :)
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