Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it? • Hacker News Board

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#441

Post by famouswaffles » Fri, Oct 10, 2025, 11:38 AM UTC

selcuka wrote: post #347

wbolt wrote: post #343

More than 300 comments here and still no convincing answer. Why the community wastes time on trying to make CPython faster when there is pypy which is already much faster? I understand pypy lacks libraries and feature parity with up to date CPython. But… can’t everyone refocus the efforts and just move to pypy to add all the missing bits and then just continue with pypy as the “official python”? Are there any serious…

> can’t everyone refocus the efforts You have answered your own question. Seriously, though. PyPy is 2-3 versions behind CPython (3.11 vs 3.14) and it's not even 100% compatible with 3.11. Libraries such as psycopg and lxml are not fully supported. It's a hard sell.

Pypy only has a handful of devs. If it had the PSF's official blessing, it wouldn't lag behind CPython so much.

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#442

Post by mrits » Fri, Oct 10, 2025, 11:38 AM UTC

stabbles wrote: post #417

Python installation size over time: 170M python-3.6.15 183M python-3.7.17 197M python-3.8.20 206M python-3.9.24 218M python-3.10.19 331M python-3.11.14 362M python-3.12.12 377M python-3.13.8 406M python-3.14.0

considering I run 3.12 on a 256MB drive, I doubt

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#443

Post by stabbles » Fri, Oct 10, 2025, 11:59 AM UTC

ptx wrote: post #437

stabbles wrote: post #417

Python installation size over time: 170M python-3.6.15 183M python-3.7.17 197M python-3.8.20 206M python-3.9.24 218M python-3.10.19 331M python-3.11.14 362M python-3.12.12 377M python-3.13.8 406M python-3.14.0

Where are you getting these numbers? Python 3.11 on Debian is around 21 MB installed size (python3.11-minimal + libpython3.11-minimal + libpython3.11-stdlib), not counting common shared dependencies like libc, ncurses, liblzma, libsqlite3, etc. Looking at the embeddable distribution for Windows (32-bit), Python 3.11 is 17.5 MB unpacked, 3.13 is slightly smaller at 17.2 MB and 3.14 is 18.4 MB (and adds the _zstd and _…

This is the "standard" configure + make + make install, which includes libpython.a, header files, Python's own tests (python -m test), plus __pycache__, and debug symbols. Distros of course may split it up into multiple packages, split out debug symbols, etc.

See `docker run -it --rm -w /store ghcr.io/spack/all-pythons:2025-10-10`.

To be fair, the main contributors are tests and the static library.

Just looking at libpython.so

     10M libpython3.6m.so.1.0
     11M libpython3.7m.so.1.0
     13M libpython3.8.so.1.0
     14M libpython3.9.so.1.0
     17M libpython3.10.so.1.0
     24M libpython3.11.so.1.0
     30M libpython3.12.so.1.0
     30M libpython3.13.so.1.0
     34M libpython3.14.so.1.0

The static library is likely large because of `--with-optimizations` enabling LTO (so smaller shared libs, but larger static libs).

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#444

Post by xmcqdpt2 » Fri, Oct 10, 2025, 12:10 PM UTC

miguelgrinberg wrote: post #227

gsibble wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or have it run some super common use case like a FastAPI endpoint or a numpy calculation. Yes, they are not all python, but it's what most people use Python for.

FastAPI is a web framework, which by definition is (or should be!) an I/O bound process. My benchmark evaluates CPU, so it's a different thing. There are a ton of web framework benchmarks out there if you are interested in FastAPI and other frameworks. And numpy is a) written in C, not Python, and b) is not part of Python, so it hasn't changed when 3.14 was released. The goal was to evaluate the Python 3.14 interpret…

Numpy is partly written in C but includes a lot of Python code. If you include scipy or scikit learn or pandas, most of the code is python calling primitive numpy C operations. I'd expect that many semi-complex data science programs to benefit from improvement in the python interpreter, especially if they weren't written in super tight numpy code.

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#445

Post by jkaplowitz » Fri, Oct 10, 2025, 12:20 PM UTC

acomjean wrote: post #310

swyx wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ah, the New Coke Gambit

Ah New Coke… Oddly I liked new coke better. My most 80s possession is a new coke can with max headroom on it. They had both new and “classic” for a while co existing.

> Oddly I liked new coke better.

Fun fact: so did most focus groups and (I think?) blind taste tests when it was just presented as a new drink, but they tended to be horrified by the idea of it actually replacing classic Coke. The problem with that switch was mostly psychological / cultural, not chemical.

Also, Diet Coke, which remains quite popular, is still based on the New Coke formula except with the sweetener swapped out. The no-calorie version of classic Coke is Coke Zero. The Coca-Cola Company has been working to increase Coke Zero's popularity, and it is now much more popular than it used to be, but I think Diet Coke continues to be more popular than Coke Zero even now.

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#446

Post by joshkel » Fri, Oct 10, 2025, 12:35 PM UTC

dhosek wrote: post #350

hajile wrote: post #331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did anyone short Cracker Barrel stock? If not, I have a hard time seeing why bots would have any interest in investing the time/money. There also didn't seem to be any political clout being gained by the complaints. More real-world is that I know tons of friends/relatives in the South and I don't know of even ONE that liked the redesign.

I recall reading somewhere about some investor who wanted to take control of cb who drove this, so less shorting and more opportunistic drive down the price to buy more shares at a lower price.

Yes. Sardar Biglari, who's an activist investor and the CEO and owner of Steak'n'Shake, has been pushing for more control over Cracker Barrel for several years. He amplified some of the backlash against Cracker Barrel.

https://fortune.com/2025/09/18/sardar-biglari-war-against-cr...

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#447

Post by DonHopkins » Fri, Oct 10, 2025, 12:43 PM UTC

tremon wrote: post #220

DonHopkins wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should hear the Dutch say "yah-vah-shchkript" with a throat clear and spit take.

The Dutch pronunciation of javascript differs from the English one only in the first syllable. Roughly zero dutchies would insert the Dutch schr- sound in a loanword, and even fewer would do that while leaving the foreign -ipt suffix intact.

Maybe they're just taking advantage of the opportunity to expectorate then.

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#448

Post by [deleted] » Fri, Oct 10, 2025, 12:46 PM UTC

Tom1380 wrote: post #424

rocqua wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm annoyed every time I have to write $(which time). But the stats given by -v are just so much more valuable from gnu-time.

Wouldn't it also work with "env time" if that's easier to type?

[deleted]

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#449

Post by pkphilip » Fri, Oct 10, 2025, 12:46 PM UTC

miguelgrinberg wrote: post #34

nadermx wrote: post #10

Tangential, but I practically owe my life to this guy. He wrote the flask mega tutorial in what I followed religiously to launch my first website. Then right before launch, in the most critical part of my entire application; piping a fragged file in flask. He answered my stackoverflow question, I put his fix live, and the site went viral. Here's the link for posterity's sake https://stackoverflow.com/a/34391304/41802…

You have made my day, sir. :)

Amazing to see all of the people thanking you! Great to see that gratitude is still alive and well. You seemed to have touched a lot of lives through that mega tutorial! wow!

Re: Python 3.14 is here. How fast is it?

#450

Post by callamdelaney » Fri, Oct 10, 2025, 12:49 PM UTC

wiseowise wrote: post #134

nadermx wrote: post #10

Tangential, but I practically owe my life to this guy. He wrote the flask mega tutorial in what I followed religiously to launch my first website. Then right before launch, in the most critical part of my entire application; piping a fragged file in flask. He answered my stackoverflow question, I put his fix live, and the site went viral. Here's the link for posterity's sake https://stackoverflow.com/a/34391304/41802…

> flask Off-topic, but I absolutely loathe new Flask logo. Old one[0] has this vintage, crafty feel. And the new one[1] looks like it was made by a starving high schooler experimenting with WordArt. [0] - https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3c/Flask_lo... [1] - https://flask.palletsprojects.com/en/stable/_images/flask-na...

Yeah I yearn to go back to flask but the logo is giving me the ick.