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Artificial intelligence is losing hype

economist.com

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Re: Artificial intelligence is losing hype

#441

Post by XMPPwocky »

blitzar wrote: post #130
lasc4r wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>We've run the 4-minute mile. >We are in for radical non-linear change. We aren't running miles much quicker than 4 mins though. The last record was 3m:43s set by Hicham El Guerrouj in 1999.

The 1-minute mile must be right around the corner, and when that inevitably gets broken, the 1-second mile will follow swiftly.

In fact, humans will be running at relativistic speeds within this century, risking the total destruction of the Earth if they should ever trip over something and fall down.

Scary stuff. And it's not science fiction- it's based on real, observed trends and scaling laws. Seems impossible? Well, they said the four-minute mile was impossible, too.

Re: Artificial intelligence is losing hype

#442

Post by chrisandchris »

Calavar wrote: post #359
_acco wrote: post #207

AI (specifically Claude Sonnet via Cursor) has completely transformed my workflow. It's changed my job description as a programmer. (And I've been doing this for 13y – no greenhorn!) This wasn't the case with GPT-4/o. This capability is very new. When I spoke to a colleague at Microsoft about these changes, they were floored. Microsoft has made themselves synonymous with AI, yet their company is barely even leveragin…

I feel like I'm living in a different universe sometimes. The consensus on HN seems to be that you can be pretty productive with LLMs as coding assistants, but every time I try I find it borderline impossible to get functional code even for pretty straightforward prompts. I decided to fire up GPT-4o again today to see if maybe things have gotten better over the past few months. I asked GPT to write code to render a t…

Same here.

A friend, whose SQL knowledge is minimal, used an LLM to query data from a database over a couple of tables. Yes, after a lot of trial and error he (most probably) got the correct data, however the only one being able to read the query is the LLM itself. It's full of coalesce, subselects that repeat the same joins again and again.

LLM will do a lot for you, but I really hate this "this will [already did] solve everything". No, it did not and no, because it's quality is those of a junior dev, at max.

Re: Artificial intelligence is losing hype

#443

Post by remoroid »

Calavar wrote: post #415
zone411 wrote: post #407

Earlier quoted context omitted.

LLMs are much better at Python and JavaScript than at C/C++. This simple difference can account for much of the variation in people's experiences.

I agree, that could explain a lot of it. I also suspect that the length of the generated code plays a role. In my experience, LLMs sometimes peter out a bit and give up if the generated program gets too long, even if it's well within their context limit. (Where giving up means writing a comment that says "the rest of the implementation goes here" or starting to have consistency issues.) Python and JavaScript tend to…

Yes, you have figured it out. LLMs are terrible for graphics programming. Web development - much better. Sonnet 3.5 is the only good model around for now. GPT 4o is very poor.

Re: Artificial intelligence is losing hype

#444

Post by [deleted] »

bruce511 wrote: post #424
mikhmha wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel the exact same way. I have felt 0 need to use an LLM in my current workflow. If I could explain concisely what my problem is in English - then I would already know the answer. In that case why would I be asking AI the question. And I don't want opinionated answers to subjective questions. Why run that through a filter, I can investigate better myself through links on the internet. By the way - I think AI or ML…

>> If I could explain concisely what my problem is in English - then I would already know the answer. In that case why would I be asking AI the question. And I don't want opinionated answers to subjective questions. Why run that through a filter, I can investigate better myself through links on the internet. I am an experienced programmer, but I find myself (for the first time) doing a deep-dive in SQL and specifical…

[deleted]

Re: Artificial intelligence is losing hype

#445

Post by rpcope1 »

anon291 wrote: post #339
gennarro wrote: post #199

I tried to do some AI database clean up this weekend - simple stuff like zip lookup and standardizing spacing, and caps - and ChatGPT managed to screw it ip over and over. It’s the sort of thing there a little error means the answer is totally wrong so I spent an hour refining the query and then addressing edge cases etc. I could have just done it all in excel in less with less chance of random (hard to catch) errors…

The point is that these problems will follow the same growth trajectory as every other tech bug. In other words, they will go away eventually. But the Rubicon is still crossed. There is a general purpose computer system that understands human language and can write real sounding human language. That's a sea change.

> "understands human language"

I've got some oceanfront property in Wyoming to sell you.

Re: Artificial intelligence is losing hype

#446

Post by magicalhippo »

Calavar wrote: post #359
_acco wrote: post #207

AI (specifically Claude Sonnet via Cursor) has completely transformed my workflow. It's changed my job description as a programmer. (And I've been doing this for 13y – no greenhorn!) This wasn't the case with GPT-4/o. This capability is very new. When I spoke to a colleague at Microsoft about these changes, they were floored. Microsoft has made themselves synonymous with AI, yet their company is barely even leveragin…

I feel like I'm living in a different universe sometimes. The consensus on HN seems to be that you can be pretty productive with LLMs as coding assistants, but every time I try I find it borderline impossible to get functional code even for pretty straightforward prompts. I decided to fire up GPT-4o again today to see if maybe things have gotten better over the past few months. I asked GPT to write code to render a t…

I was skeptical like you, but recently decided to try it out. I wasn't expecting much, and as such I was slightly surprised.

For example, just now my NAS stopped working because the boot device went offline. So I got to thinking about writing a simple syslog server. I've never looked at the syslog protocol before, and I've never done any low-level TCP/UDP work in C# yet.

So I asked ChatGPT to generate some code[1], and while the result is not perfect it's certainly better than nothing, and would save me time to get going.

As another example, a friend who's not very technical wanted to make an Arduino circuit to perform some automated experiment. He's dabbled with programing and can modify code, but struggles to get going. Again just for kicks, I asked ChatGPT and it provided a very nice starting point[2].

For exploratory stuff like this, it seems to provide a nice alternative to searching and piecing together the bits. Revolutionary is a quite loaded word, but it's certainly not just a slight improvement on what we had before LLMs and instead feels like a quantum leap.

[1]: https://chatgpt.com/share/f4343939-74f1-404d-bfac-b903525f61... (modified, see reply)

[2]: https://chatgpt.com/share/fc764e73-f01f-4a7c-ab58-f43da3e077...

Re: Artificial intelligence is losing hype

#447

Post by [deleted] »

Calavar wrote: post #359
_acco wrote: post #207

AI (specifically Claude Sonnet via Cursor) has completely transformed my workflow. It's changed my job description as a programmer. (And I've been doing this for 13y – no greenhorn!) This wasn't the case with GPT-4/o. This capability is very new. When I spoke to a colleague at Microsoft about these changes, they were floored. Microsoft has made themselves synonymous with AI, yet their company is barely even leveragin…

I feel like I'm living in a different universe sometimes. The consensus on HN seems to be that you can be pretty productive with LLMs as coding assistants, but every time I try I find it borderline impossible to get functional code even for pretty straightforward prompts. I decided to fire up GPT-4o again today to see if maybe things have gotten better over the past few months. I asked GPT to write code to render a t…

[deleted]

Re: Artificial intelligence is losing hype

#448

Post by anonzzzies »

Calavar wrote: post #359
_acco wrote: post #207

AI (specifically Claude Sonnet via Cursor) has completely transformed my workflow. It's changed my job description as a programmer. (And I've been doing this for 13y – no greenhorn!) This wasn't the case with GPT-4/o. This capability is very new. When I spoke to a colleague at Microsoft about these changes, they were floored. Microsoft has made themselves synonymous with AI, yet their company is barely even leveragin…

I feel like I'm living in a different universe sometimes. The consensus on HN seems to be that you can be pretty productive with LLMs as coding assistants, but every time I try I find it borderline impossible to get functional code even for pretty straightforward prompts. I decided to fire up GPT-4o again today to see if maybe things have gotten better over the past few months. I asked GPT to write code to render a t…

> but every time I try I find it borderline impossible to get functional code even for pretty straightforward prompts.

I work in 9 different projects now and I would say that around 80% of functional code comes from Sonnet (like GP) for these projects. These are not (all) trivial either; there is a very niche (for banking) key/value store written in Go for instance which has a lot of edge cases etc, all the plumbing (x,err = etc aka stuff people find annoying) comes from sonnet and works one-shot. A lot of business logic comes from sonnet too; it works but usually needs a little tweaking to make it correct.

Tests are all done by Sonnet. I think 80% is low balling it on Go code really.

We have a lot of complex code generator stuff and DSLs in TS which also works well often. Sometimes it gets some edge cases wrong, but either re-prompting with more details or fixing it ourselves, will do it. At a fraction of the time/money of what a fully human team would deliver.

I wrote a 3d editor for fun with Sonnet in a day.

I have terrible results with gpt/copilot (copilot is good for editing instead of complete files/functions; chatgpt is not good much compared with sonnet); it doesn't get close at all; it simply keeps giving me the same code over and over again when I say it's wrong; it hardcodes things specifically asked to make flexible etc. Not sure why the difference is so massive all of sudden.

Note: I use the sonnet API, not the web interface, but same for gpt so...

Re: Artificial intelligence is losing hype

#449

Post by anonzzzies »

chrisandchris wrote: post #442
Calavar wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like I'm living in a different universe sometimes. The consensus on HN seems to be that you can be pretty productive with LLMs as coding assistants, but every time I try I find it borderline impossible to get functional code even for pretty straightforward prompts. I decided to fire up GPT-4o again today to see if maybe things have gotten better over the past few months. I asked GPT to write code to render a t…

Same here. A friend, whose SQL knowledge is minimal, used an LLM to query data from a database over a couple of tables. Yes, after a lot of trial and error he (most probably) got the correct data, however the only one being able to read the query is the LLM itself. It's full of coalesce, subselects that repeat the same joins again and again. LLM will do a lot for you, but I really hate this "this will [already did] s…

> because it's quality is those of a junior dev, at max.

Echo chamber/bias I guess. I know many, many seniors with big pay checks working for big companies who are vastly worse than sonnet at the moment. Juniors stand literally no chance unless very talented.

Re: Artificial intelligence is losing hype

#450

Post by mikhmha »

bruce511 wrote: post #424
mikhmha wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel the exact same way. I have felt 0 need to use an LLM in my current workflow. If I could explain concisely what my problem is in English - then I would already know the answer. In that case why would I be asking AI the question. And I don't want opinionated answers to subjective questions. Why run that through a filter, I can investigate better myself through links on the internet. By the way - I think AI or ML…

>> If I could explain concisely what my problem is in English - then I would already know the answer. In that case why would I be asking AI the question. And I don't want opinionated answers to subjective questions. Why run that through a filter, I can investigate better myself through links on the internet. I am an experienced programmer, but I find myself (for the first time) doing a deep-dive in SQL and specifical…

Recently I saw the process of filling for 2 insurance claims through 2 different entities. First one used a great ai voice agent that does the process of filtering your query. it understood me perfectly. But then I still had to wait in line for an actual agent. Ok wait for 6 hours. Whatever. Call again - the 2nd time going through the same agent is painful. Its so slow. And all this just to connect me to a human - who was EXCELLENT. What did ai add? And for now a human has to be involved in any complex permission changes to your account. AND I like that.

The 2nd agency I called them through phone. No ai. But it is excellent cause they do async processing. so you reserve a slot and they call you back. i don't care if those are not answered urgently. Because I just want to talk to a human.

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