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Trucking startup Convoy closes operations with no buyer

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Re: Trucking startup Convoy closes operations with no buyer

#441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Providing employees with de novo severance after you know it's going under guarantees creditor lawsuits. Citation needed. Providing executive suite with bonuses and parachutes does. Indeed, even law firms talk about this: > Severance payments to “insiders” (generally defined under the Bankruptcy Code as officers, directors, persons in control of the business, and relatives of such individual(s)) could be subject to…

Clawback is one year for insiders, 90 days for all others [1]. We're describing something closer to simultaneity, where "the debtor enters into a severance agreement simultaneously with an employee’s termination" [2]. This is precedented for clawback, and would almost certainly be litigated given the number of employees involved. TL; DR The moment you find the business insolvent, it belongs to your creditors. Many co…

In [1], it'd be hard for a trustee to argue that making severance payments to rank and file employees is not something "made in the ordinary course of business" (which is a statutory defense against clawback).

Your reference in [2] refers to an executive, an "insider", which is exactly what I said - that there is precedent against allowing such payments to insiders (hence the one-year clawback window).

I still can't find any cases where unsecured creditors have successfully injuncted a bankrupt company from making severance payments to non-executive employees.

> With Toys ‘R’ Us, the creditors voluntarily provided the severance [4].

The creditors did no such thing. From your source, emphasis mine:

> Two of the private equity firms that used to own the defunct toy store have allocated $20 million to a severance fund that will be distributed in the coming months."

The mediators who were handling part of the bankruptcy proceedings agreed to administrate the disbursement of funds.

Re: Trucking startup Convoy closes operations with no buyer

#442
post #411

Never heard of this company. Thought it was another automated trucking company. Bloomberg profile of the company shows it’s actually a platform for truckers (finding “routes”), and larger companies to manage routes, their fleets, and status of delivery. Most of this appears to rely on GPS. Not sure why this was valued at $3.8B. Wall Street investment bankers smoking crack while evaluating this one.

> Never heard of this company.

Well that puts you in a perfect position to value it.

Re: Trucking startup Convoy closes operations with no buyer

#444
post #412

There are some really profound misunderstandings of how bankruptcy and credit work in this thread. Creditors are ranked by seniority and get paid out in order by seniority. Equity is below every creditor and has been completely wiped out. Companies are not allowed to take cash or sell the furniture to pay out employees. That money is legally owed to creditors and attempting to stiff them is theft. I'm sorry to those…

Just to clarify your point about paying out employees... in what sense do you mean that? Some quick googling says that when a company goes into Chapter 7, employees become creditors for their unpaid wages, which means that they are at least in the same boat as other creditors (although it seems like they might sometimes be prioritized).

Your source is talking about unpaid wages (legally mandatory), but severance is additional (legally optional) payments the company chooses to make to support former employees.

Re: Trucking startup Convoy closes operations with no buyer

#445
post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Startups are not established businesses. They are inherently risky ventures. If you want to be coddled and showered with benefits, go join a Fortune 500. Startups are not for you.

I'd hardly call "Series E" a startup. Just a company that was bleeding money.

Everything's a startup until its business model is self-sustaining/provable.

A lot of even large companies never leave the startup phase.

Re: Trucking startup Convoy closes operations with no buyer

#446
We normally talk about the risk burden of founders (we're all either founders or will be soon, right?).

We don't often talk about how everyone involved in a business takes on risk. This is a great example of all the employees risking being cut off from funds and health care.

Those employees won't be lionized for "learning from their mistakes" when they get a new (better paying?) job, will they?

Those employees also didn't get a say in how the company was run despite the fact that they were taking a serious risk, too. Probably a more serious risk than a founder, given that most founders are wealthy or backed by wealth.

Convoy closing sucks. But it does not suck at all as an illustration of the problems in startup culture . . .

Re: Trucking startup Convoy closes operations with no buyer

#447
post #409

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Company shutdown != layoff.

Yes it does though? The legal entity of the company still exists, it’s just no longer conducting business or paying employees. Thats a mass layoff. The California version of the WARN Act explicitly covers terminating business operations.

Okay, sue them.

Re: Trucking startup Convoy closes operations with no buyer

#448
post #430
post #412

There are some really profound misunderstandings of how bankruptcy and credit work in this thread. Creditors are ranked by seniority and get paid out in order by seniority. Equity is below every creditor and has been completely wiped out. Companies are not allowed to take cash or sell the furniture to pay out employees. That money is legally owed to creditors and attempting to stiff them is theft. I'm sorry to those…

Unless the law has changed, in California back pay is senior to everything except tax debt. And the company officers are personally liable for it. It should work that way everywhere. Executives need to be incentivized to do layoffs while there’s still cash for it. Defrauding employees is a terrible evil.

Have you seen anything suggesting the employees are not getting their final paychecks? All I've seen is them not getting severance.

Re: Trucking startup Convoy closes operations with no buyer

#449
post #389

The entitlement in the comments for severance, healthcare etc baffles me. You were paid a salary for your services while you were employed. You didn't give more, they didn't pay less. Now you're not - that's the end of the contract. Yes, it's a nice thing some companies do when they lay people off but that can't be an expectation.

[dead]

Re: Trucking startup Convoy closes operations with no buyer

#450
post #411

Never heard of this company. Thought it was another automated trucking company. Bloomberg profile of the company shows it’s actually a platform for truckers (finding “routes”), and larger companies to manage routes, their fleets, and status of delivery. Most of this appears to rely on GPS. Not sure why this was valued at $3.8B. Wall Street investment bankers smoking crack while evaluating this one.

Because trucking is an enormous industry and $3.8b is a tiny slice. Sure, it's a tough nut to crack, but if someone does crack it they can be worth a lot more than that.
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