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Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

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Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

False allegations should carry the same penalty as the crime being alleged.

No they shouldn't, because such laws will just open the door to even more abuse. Imagine you are raped by someone. You go to the police to report the crime, but unfortunately, they deny, and you can't provide any real evidence. They can now countersue because you've made a "false allegation" which ruined their life.

Presumably for a "false accusation" conviction one would have to prove that (1) the accusations are false, and (2) the accuser was aware that the accusations were false. Merely failing to prove accusations (such as when there is insufficient evidence) would be insufficient for a false accusation conviction, as neither of these requirements are satisfied.

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#442
post #431

Earlier quoted context omitted.

CEOs and politicians are even higher-prestige jobs dominated by men, but the sense of moral urgency around achieving gender balance in those jobs seems significantly lower. Police officers have a lot of power in society & are mostly male. I think there's a strong case to be made that bringing women into the force would be very beneficial, in terms of improved handling of sexual assault cases and reduced police violen…

That's not true, at least in the UK the gender and racial balance of the police force comes up a lot in the media. It's often mentioned about UK politicians too, ie the gender balance of cabinet positions. Perhaps your view of the apparent moral urgency is because you're in the tech industry and therefore closer to it?

>That's not true, at least in the UK the gender and racial balance of the police force comes up a lot in the media.

Fair enough, I've never seen discussion of police gender balance here in the US.

>Perhaps your view of the apparent moral urgency is because you're in the tech industry and therefore closer to it?

I doubt that's it. I feel like I've seen a lot more coverage of "Women in Tech" in mainstream news sources than any other "Gender in Career" pairing.

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#443
post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe the parent is using the word “religion” in a different way than you seem to realize, and in a much more general way, similar to how this concept is for example used in archaeological histories of human kind, i.e. the Sapiens book. Religion, in this sense, is not specifically referring to some specific practice of spiritual beliefs, but rather a more general shared abstract perspective among a group of peopl…

Thanks for this feedback. I am not sure I get the proper perspective after it, but it is still nice to have a feedback like that. To my mind religion on a broad view includes practices like animism, for sure. So I would tend to believe I get your point. On the other hand, a statement like "The old religions you were at least judged by an omnipotent being who could see the whole picture" seems to precise to match a br…

I interpreted it differently, as the "religion of the justice system" where a single "judge" oversees the whole picture, hearing from both sides, to make a proper judgement that is ideally objective and based in the "religion" of law. "Omnipotent" doesn't mean a God, necessarily; indeed one of its main definitions is "having great power and influence", which applies to a court justice.

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#444

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think your argument quite works. Suppose I'm a superintendent worried about the teacher shortage. Wouldn't it make sense for me to try & bring more men into the profession, in order to keep salaries low and fill my vacant teaching positions? I think maybe there's a workable argument along these lines: Both nursing and teaching are bureaucratic industries with heavy government involvement. The price system doe…

>Wouldn't it make sense for me to try & bring more men into the profession, in order to keep salaries low and fill my vacant teaching positions? I think at this point salary already doesn't matter as wages are already depressed. In other words, fishing for true workplace equity isn't an altruistic endeavor as much as cost savings. Once that is achieved, it's irrelevant who populates the industry. Nobody is interested…

>Nobody is interested in hiring male teachers as costs are already down and there's plenty of female applicants lined up

Not exactly, teacher shortages are widespread in the US.

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#445

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The real issue is that people stopped caring about whatever the justice system is going to decide. There's a new religion of social justice, and this religion is harsher than even the old religions. The old religions you were at least judged by an omnipotent being who could see the whole picture. This new woke religion have you judged by a dumb mob. Everyone's playing the judge and everyone's responsible to punishing…

Everything in your comment is pretty reasonable until this: >And this is a direct result of lack of religion You claim this like it's proven to be true. It's not. The reason for this inherent ask for social justice in my opinion has nothing to do with religion. Instead, I feel like people got disappointed in existing justice system, looking at nasty people going through life unfazed, even though it is painfully obvio…

Not OP and also kinda disagree with them at the surface value of the statement, but maybe not with the underlying premise.

One of the worst people I know are "religious". Some of the kindest people I know are also religious. This gave me cognitive dissonance for while about religion.

Then I realised that all the horrible people were actually communal narcissists who grab onto the lowest hanging fruit, which is performative religion. They just want to be seen as holier-than-thou, and Churches (applies to most other religious communities, I'm just trying to be brief).

Church is no longer the lowest hanging fruit, but social media is; that's their new holier-than-thou platform.

Now, back to their core premise: I don't think religion is what these people are missing, but a sense of wholesomeness and mindfulness.

Different forms of religious practices can give people this wholesomeness and mindfulness.

My preferred practice is meditation, but I'm not really that spiritual. I guess am a bit inwardly, but I doubt anybody would describe me as spiritual.

I think it's no coincidence independent religions have developed similar methods to quiet, direct and focus the mind.

Buddhism and mediation is just the closest thing to a repeatable, scientific approach that developed. Probably because there's little externalities involved.

So, I guess their intuition about lack of religious practices is correct (In my layman opinion), but I think it runs deeper (at a mental/psychological level) rather than a divine one.

A great book I would recommend is "The Mind Illuminated" by John Yates. It covers briefly what I outlined earlier, but with a historic lense, and it also covers the colourful history of meditation and Buddhism (also briefly).

It's not so much about mediation history, but more a manual on how to meditate (written by a neuroscientists who had this same intuition about religious practices I describe above, but he explores it through his expertise as a neuroscientist, and eventually landed on mediation as the "best" practice for the mind).

There's also some spirituality in it, but if you're anti-spiritual, you can gloss over them.

Back on the topic of this thread:

I think all these witch-craft style trends we had in the past are signs of weak, idle and chaotic minds. This isn't to say every progressive person is like this (I consider myself progressive), but some are, and they paint what should be a great movement into something bad.

And let me be clear, those same weak and disregulated minds are not exclusive to the latest woke movement, they are equally as present in the opposite side, but that side just had a much smaller stage currently. That's probably because we, people as a collective, realise that being progressive is good, so we have been more tolerant of the bullshit from one side than we are from the other.

Ideally, we should be progressive without the bullshit. But alas, human nature is flawed, so we have to endure socially fad after fad in the hopes that one day we will finally learn a lesson.

Edit: wanted to add, I in no way mean to say that being spiritual or believing in a higher power is bad. If it works for some: great for them! I just think it's less "robust" if that makes sense? I'm not quite sure how better to describe it; I'd have to sit and think about better formulating it

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#446

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What was the proof? Very fortunate indeed!

We had a gaming party at work on a Friday afternoon, and I happened to have recorded my games. Reviewing it, I found I did play against her (and 2 others) in a free-for all. But it was clear she just fabricated the events. Funnily enough while I was playing her, I didn't even know it was her (it was a woman I barely knew and only had spoken to a couple of times). Anyway, presented with the actual recording she droppe…

Then get on with making sure people are crystal clear what happened and how to protect themselves.

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#447

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the peers.

The main reason why girls are not choosing STEM is because it doesn't intrest them as much. You can try to put the blame on anything you want, but that's reality. I love technical things and am the father of 1 son and 3 girls. I of course would love to do technical things with all of them. With my son it's easy to get him excited about lego and such. With my girls? Well, maybe you should give it a try. I decided to p…

Are your girls representative of the entire female population?

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Billy Graham/Mike Pence rule is your best bet: don't let yourself be in any situation where a false accusation could arise. Of course you'll be accused of being a sexist/misogynist/whatever instead but that's easier to ignore or overcome than false accusations of sexual harassment.

Hard disagree. If I decide I can have a closed-door 1:1 or a lunch 1:1 with some of my direct reports but not with any that are female, I’m inherently discriminating against them. I’d way rather treat all employees fairly and fade a <1% chance of a false accusation than to treat employees unequally and cut that chance in half.

[deleted]

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#449

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not quite right actually - charges weren't dropped, because no charges were actually ever laid. Allegations were made, the case was dropped for lack of evidence, he was allowed to leave the country, another prosecutor later re-opened the case and then an Interpol Red notice was raised for 'questioning'. Anyway, if you change that to "the case was dropped" then that is technically correct, but the whole case wa…

It'd take a book to list all the insanity in that case. A book which will get hard to write, because the CPS and the Swedish prosecutors have been deleting evidence like crazy. One of the few things we do know was that the Swedish prosecutor was threatened when she wanted to drop the case ("Don't you dare get cold feet").

> One of the few things we do know was that the Swedish prosecutor was threatened when she wanted to drop the case ("Don't you dare get cold feet").

It's sad and disappointing this can happen, but it also made me snort a little, because, in a way they gave her cold feet over getting cold feet.

Re: Google exec fired after female boss groped him at drunken bash, suit says

#450
post #443

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for this feedback. I am not sure I get the proper perspective after it, but it is still nice to have a feedback like that. To my mind religion on a broad view includes practices like animism, for sure. So I would tend to believe I get your point. On the other hand, a statement like "The old religions you were at least judged by an omnipotent being who could see the whole picture" seems to precise to match a br…

I interpreted it differently, as the "religion of the justice system" where a single "judge" oversees the whole picture, hearing from both sides, to make a proper judgement that is ideally objective and based in the "religion" of law. "Omnipotent" doesn't mean a God, necessarily; indeed one of its main definitions is "having great power and influence", which applies to a court justice.

Interesting perspective, thank you for sharing it.
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