Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The Full Chess Cheating Report of Hans Neiman

chess.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

441–450 of 486 posts

Re: The Full Chess Cheating Report of Hans Neiman

#441

Post by seba_dos1 »

rowanG077 wrote: post #268
xxs wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't need 'hundreds' fps - you can do it w/ 10sec and get better reaction time than humans (reaction under 100ms in track events is consider foul). It should not be so difficult with a separate GPU and a capture card. Serial mouse/keyboard inputs are trivial as well.

How is Serial mouse/keyboard trivial? You'd need to make a custom mouse that receives data from your second PC. You'd probably want it to be wireless else you will have 2 cables coming out of it. And no just having a second fake mouse is not fair. That's easily detectable by software and would definitely raise a lot of red flags.

It is trivial. All you need is a device that can work as a USB gadget that you can plug your keyboard into. I could do it with my phone, many Raspberry Pi-like SBCs, or even Arduino-like boards...

Re: The Full Chess Cheating Report of Hans Neiman

#442

Post by School-Cotton »

rossdavidh wrote: post #417
School-Cotton wrote: post #405

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Brain plasticity is real. If I dropped everything and devoted my life to studying Chinese I would still never learn to speak it as well as a child who grew up in China. I think both effects have something to do with it.

Definitely brain plasticity is real, but there are people who learn to speak languages as adults, with native proficiency. I recall hearing on the radio, people in India who (as adults) learned a Midwestern US accent, because they were doing phone support and they could get through each phone call quicker if the old person on the other end of the line wasn't confused by an Indian accent. I am a midwesterner, and I co…

Actually I did something similar - learned to speak French with no perceptible foreign accent at age 17 (unfortunately my abilities have decayed in the intervening years, so I’m sure now I’d sound American, but anyway…)

However, accent is only one part of language. I certainly didn’t have the vocabulary, reading speed, writing elegance, etc. of (educated) native speakers.

Re: The Full Chess Cheating Report of Hans Neiman

#443

Post by the_only_law »

JshWright wrote: post #420
the_only_law wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oddly I saw a conversation about exactly this a few days ago.

Yeah, that was the (perhaps slightly too obscure) reference.

I see. I wasn’t too familiar with the specifics, I just happened to walk into a convo about it. I thought they were all talking about local people at the time, not a national news item.

Re: The Full Chess Cheating Report of Hans Neiman

#444

Post by avgcorrection »

lysp wrote: post #19

> The conventional wisdom is that if you are not a GM by age 14, it is unlikely that you can reach the top levels of chess. > While that statement may seem discouraging, it has been borne out in modern chess. > Greats like Fischer, Kasparov, Carlsen, and almost all of the modern GMs who have been established as top five players, were notable GMs by age 15 at the latest Wow.

> > While that statement may seem discouraging, it has been borne out in modern chess.

Totally unnecessary sentence that just leads to derailment (like in this subthread).

Re: The Full Chess Cheating Report of Hans Neiman

#445

Post by avgcorrection »

User23 wrote: post #164
bsder wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> > The conventional wisdom is that if you are not a GM by age 14, it is unlikely that you can reach the top levels of chess. This is confusing correlation and causation. One thing that people don't realize is the sheer amount of money required to become a "GM". You have to get a certain number of "norms" from FIDE and the requirements list is a PITA: https://chessgoals.com/how-to-get-a-grandmaster-norm/ If you don't…

That's why I quit playing seriously when I was still an underclassman. It was overwhelmingly obvious that merely being well above average was completely irrelevant, and there was absolutely no practical reason for me to play chess whatsoever. Although it did subsequently get me laid once or twice, which in retrospect still surprises me.

Imagine how barren a sport/hobby/field is when you feel compelled to point out that you had sex two times during your stint in it.

Re: The Full Chess Cheating Report of Hans Neiman

#446

Post by chakhs »

ajhurliman wrote: post #98

One way to settle it: Grudge match... in an isolated room, fully naked, x-ray scans, in a Faraday cage, no coverage until the match is over.

Drama aside, no-one seriously thinks Hans can measure up to Magnus. The outcome of that match heavily favors Magnus, even players like Nepo, Caruana, Firouzja are underdogs.

Re: The Full Chess Cheating Report of Hans Neiman

#447

Post by chakhs »

jmartrican wrote: post #380

I did see a round of speed chess between Magnus and Hans, I think it was 60 seconds on the clock. Does speed chess have the same cheating problem is the regular format?

Less probable but it's quite trivial to make a browser extension or something of the sort for cheating (feeding moves to engine and showing suggestions)

Re: The Full Chess Cheating Report of Hans Neiman

#448

Post by mrguyorama »

vkou wrote: post #298
lmm wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I really can't shake my personal feeling that chess as a sport is just simply dead, especially as an online e-sport. Especially in combination with the possibility that there's plenty more cheating that they're not catching/detecting. Online chess is bigger than ever, and some kind of botting/cheating is possible for virtually every e-sport (indeed I'd say many are easier than chess). This is a major scandal that s…

Cheating is common in e-sports, but it is rare in high-level competitive e-sports. Sure, you may be a 'gaming chair enthusiast', using a cheat when in your online Apex or Forntite pub games, but you can't bring it with you to a tournament. Starcraft is about the only e-sport where I can see tournament cheating providing a very large advantage for a single bit of information - a player who can be notified that he is b…

CSGO has had multiple instances of players bringing cheats with them to huge tournaments.

Re: The Full Chess Cheating Report of Hans Neiman

#449

Post by rowanG077 »

barrkel wrote: post #440
rowanG077 wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

7ms is enough. But that is one in a chain of latencies. 150ms is way too long if you want your trigger to be effective. In 150ms the enemy has moved out of your crosshair. Humans deal with that with dynamic adjustment but the AI will just click the mouse. I'd think you'd need to hit less then 25ms end to end and even that might not be enough for far away targets.

The AI would need to lead the target under any reasonable implementation. Just clicking the mouse when crosshairs are over a target would scarcely deserve the name AI.

Leading the targets makes this MUCH harder from just an over the counter object detection AI. In fact making that and making it look human so it's not trivially detectable would blow this from a weekend project you can do in a few hours(Which I already doubt.) To weeks/months/years long project since you need it be really humanlike... Even now cutting edge AI can be spotted by humans.

Re: The Full Chess Cheating Report of Hans Neiman

#450

Post by samatman »

Dalewyn wrote: post #121
moron4hire wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A game is defined by its very specific set of rules. This can easily be seen in chess, which has a huge variety of variants. Or how one, minor rule change in baseball and you've got people wondering if the Hall of Fame even make sense anymore. Once a set of rules are defined, competitions and tournaments within those rules are meant to determine the best people in that game. When a player cheats, and rationalizes it…

Here's the thing though: How do you know a player cheated? Because you caught him. So what about all the cheaters who are never caught? You can't say they're cheaters. Therefore, if a player cheats but is never caught, he isn't a cheater. If a player isn't a cheater, whatever he did is legitimate and it isn't a problem. Therefore: Cheating is only a problem if you're caught. Put another way, the rules only tell you t…

You seem to think, and I don't agree, that "cheater" is like "felon", a label which is applied after some process.

I consider it like "thief". A thief is a thief when they thieve. A cheater is a cheat when they cheat.

Post reply on HN