Live data from Hacker News

With Proton and Steam Play, many Windows games now work on Linux

protondb.com

441–450 of 560 posts

Re: With Proton and Steam Play, many Windows games now work on Linux

#441
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Forgive my ignorance, but why do game servers ban Linux players in pvp games? Fear of some sort of modding only available on Linux?

Modern anticheats are basically kernel rootkits which go even to the point of trying to checksum your drivers and inspect how they work. They're basically as invasive as they get. They obviously can't hook into Linux kernel so they react by just banning the player.

Something that I find interesting is that anti-cheats are needed when either 1) the input can be somehow enhanced (think fps aim hacks) or 2) more information than the player should have is being sent to client (think fog of war or wall hacks). That's hard to avoid in shooters, where you need that behind-the-scenes information to reduce perceived latency. But games that don't have that low-latency-hungry "twitch" element, like strategy games, turn-based, etc., can make do without information that would enable hacking (and they usually don't benefit from input hacking either). I'm currently working on a pvp strategy game that uses an exaggerated input delay as a game mechanic, which also gets rid of the need to send information that the player shouldn't have: ground-truth is computed server-side and after pruning and transforming according to each player's perception, streamed to the clients. That's unhackable in the game hacking sense.

Re: With Proton and Steam Play, many Windows games now work on Linux

#442
post #399
post #22

Another Linux gamer. I seriously don't miss windows anymore. At this point I'm not worried about compatibility, but rather shitty game companies banning you the second they figure out you're playing on linux. This is especially an issue in PvE heavy games that have only small PvP elements. Looking at you Destiny 2. I really wish companies stopped their draconian policies about Linux gaming. Or at the very least just…

I went the opposite way and got rid of Linux for windows wsl2. I have the random issue but otherwise things run pretty well.

Did the same. Was just not worth the risk of waiting until an issue gets fixed. Or if it even gets fixed. I mean even in GTA 5 working perfectly, the overlay always had an issue of a missing mouse pointer.

Also Microsoft Store bought games do not work on Linux.

Well and in the end i just want to play my games. And if i want to start modding, don't get me started on the hoops you have to jump through just to get a modded Skyrim with everything installed how you like it.

Re: With Proton and Steam Play, many Windows games now work on Linux

#443
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Modern anticheats are basically kernel rootkits which go even to the point of trying to checksum your drivers and inspect how they work. They're basically as invasive as they get. They obviously can't hook into Linux kernel so they react by just banning the player.

Capitalism at its finest. Harmful measures to ensure profits, and mostly getting a pass because.. shiny things.

What are you talking about? Game makers are trying to make fun games for people to spend time on and enjoy

Re: With Proton and Steam Play, many Windows games now work on Linux

#444

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed, however after months of being "Linux only" (Manjaro KDE + Proton), just this weekend I broke and installed a Windows as a dual-boot option. 90% of games with Proton "just work" like you said. It is amazing. But then there's that one game that doesn't work, or works but with half the fps... for me, it was Death Stranding. It runs at 60+ fps at 1440p on Windows, but runs at half that on Proton, with horrible ar…

If you're privileged enough you could buy another GPU, pass it through to a Windows VM, install looking-glass to pass display output over a shared memory buffer, barrier for mouse sharing and bam, you have Windows in a window in your Linux machine running close to bare metal performance. (It does eat memory bandwidth linearly with refresh rate though).

This won’t get passed anti cheats though.

Re: With Proton and Steam Play, many Windows games now work on Linux

#445

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On Linux, you can check to see if the kernel is operating in lockdown mode to verify the integrity of the system. Lockdown mode forces all modules to be digitally signed and trusted by the kernel keyring before they can be loaded. This would functionally be equivalent to what you do on Windows.

Don't you mean tainted? https://unix.stackexchange.com/a/118117/14305

[deleted]

Re: With Proton and Steam Play, many Windows games now work on Linux

#447
post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe the game servers could not send the whole game state to each client and validate input it receives from each client? Banning blatant aimbots is just a pure statistics thing. Also, you could just train ai to detect patterns of cheating via an adversarial model where you pit normal ai against ai that uses the cheats you currently detect via rootkits. Games should not be part of my ring 0.

Game companies do take a similar approach to what you're describing, but still feel the need to run anticheat. If you ban aimbots based purely on statistics, you'll just encourage cheat developers to change the statistical properties of their aimbots. Cheats are a fairly big business — even detecting them with anticheat software in ring 0 doesn't seem to be a surefire guard against cheating.

Well, if an aimbot is only statistically as good as a good human player, does it matter anymore whether the player actually plays or a good bot?

If it is only as good as a real player than it won’t be invincible and will be equivalent to playing with a few AIs in a multiplayer game - which already happens.

Also, I believe the exact mouse movement will not be the same for a human and an aimbot - so not only statistics can be used to ban players

Re: With Proton and Steam Play, many Windows games now work on Linux

#448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It wouldn't be the first time, there's a bunch of games on Stadia that have no public Linux build or Vulkan support in their Windows build Maybe Google are licensing a proprietary DX->VK wrapper for Stadia developers to use, so they can't release it elsewhere?

> Maybe Google are licensing a proprietary DX->VK wrapper for Stadia developers to use, so they can't release it elsewhere? If they are using a wrapper it is probably just dxvk with extra stadia specific patches. ( https://github.com/doitsujin/dxvk )

DXVK is for DirectX 11 and earlier, not for DirectX 12

Re: With Proton and Steam Play, many Windows games now work on Linux

#449

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From my experience, I think it is. A non-small part of multiplayer game engineering is to handle latency. With streaming you have none of that, and even if the connection just stutters for a few 10's of ms you will get a horrible playback experience. Game streaming is most comparable to live video streaming with a frighteningly small buffer (< 10 ms).

The GeForce Now client itself told me my connection was good enough for gaming... I’m not arguing that wired cables aren’t faster, but these streaming services aren’t advertising based off of that and their own clients aren’t requiring that level of performance either.

I have Ubiquiti home networking, and sometimes play GFN or Steamlink over wifi a few feet from an AP, but just trust me that wired is always better than wifi, regardless of what a rudimentary connection test tells you. If you have the option of trying wired, just do it and see for yourself.
Post reply on HN