Live data from Hacker News

Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

nationalreview.com

441–450 of 1001 posts

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#441
post #415

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is well know that Hunter had a drug problem. It came up in the last debate.

But the video comes from the same laptop...

It’s unlikely that video was taken with the laptop. Who copies a video of themself smoking crack onto a laptop and drops it off at a repair shop?

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#442
post #54

There's a recurring argument on social media censorship that goes: "you wouldn't want the telephone company censoring phone conversations would you?" And the response is along the lines: "these are hardly private conversations, any tweet can go viral and be seen by millions". This story breaks that mold in that it involves social media censoring private conversations via DM. If you think that's OK for Twitter on its…

I think it's absolutely okay for AT&T to censor what it wants on its phone network, provided I have the freedom to use a competitor. Back in the day, we broke up AT&T for precisely the reason that people didn't have that freedom. And then we let them merge back together, for some reason.

I also think that not only is it legally permissible for Gmail to censor links, they do so already. Try reliably delivering a newsletter from a brand-new domain name (I have). Censorship isn't any better when it's the emergent effects of unknowable spam filtering and abuse algorithms than a decision by a human. (I'd say it's worse, because at least you can ask the human what they were thinking.) But the solution there is for consumers to stop using products that don't do what they want, not for big government to tell companies how to implement technical systems.

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#443

Let's be honest, the only people screaming for censorship are firmly on the left. Controlling "disinformation" is a dog whistle for censorship, hoping that average citizens don't realize what they're really after. We all know who is going to be the moderators in flagging "disinformation" and we all know which ideology they overwhelmingly favor. I'd sooner trust a pyromaniac as fire chief of my local county than I wou…

The only reason measures to curb disinformation would have a partisan impact is because conservative parties (throughout the industrialized world, not just in the US) use disinformation strategies far, far more than do other parties.

Center-left/left parties use reality to galvanize their base voters into action. Their voters are people who aren't pleased with what's happening in their countries and want to change it for the better. There's no need for center-left parties to lie that their electoral opponents eat babies when their electoral opponents actually put children in cages.

In contrast, right wing parties overcome the inherent unpopularity of their revealed policy platforms (running on platforms of cutting taxes on the very rich while making life harder for the average person is not popular) by using disinformation to make a stated platform based on fabricated wedge issues. Hence, the imaginary convoys of South American migrants that were about to storm the US-Mexico border in 2018.

As such, restricting disinformation will have a partisan impact. Within the US, there is no Democratic equivalent to Qanon, so anti-disinformation measures that impact the likes of Qanon will have no impact on the Democratic party whatsoever.

Functioning societies must have zero tolerance for 'alternative facts.' Disagree over goals and interpretations, but facts must be accepted by all. Democracy requires an informed electorate and there can be no functioning democracy when one side is free to invent its own version of reality.

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#444
post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and they've never seemed to misclassify any They do, my local politician robo-calls all his constituents with info, and T-Mobile always flags his calls as spam. I guess in a way it's spam since it's unsolicited? But it's real info, and relevant to the local people he's calling, and keeping people informed is part of his job.

Unless it's something they specifically signed up for, robo-calling all your constituents absolutely is spam.

I have been getting unsolicited e-mail from my local state rep, and I actually appreciate it. It's not campaign-type stuff, it's actual info about what's happening in this district and resources that are being provided.

Granted that feels different than a phone call, but the intent may be the same.

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#445

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're going to need to be a bit more specific as your article offers a very similar interpretaiton of platform vs publisher (without using those terms), to what I presented. The only thing of note I see in your article is a "deep dive" into figuring out the "original intention" behind the law. I believe modern application of a law should matter more than what the writers of the law were potentially thinking at the t…

> I believe modern application of a law should matter more than what the writers of the law were potentially thinking at the time. Section 230 has never been applied this way. Some people want to change it, but they haven't yet. There is no legal precedent that those people have to stand behind. You're asking the courts to change the law based on executive preference. That's dangerous for a wide variety of reasons (e…

From GP's article:

>Then we get to these early internet services like CompuServe and Prodigy in the early ‘90s. CompuServe is like the Wild West. It basically says, “We’re not going to moderate anything.” Prodigy says, “We’re going to have moderators, and we’re going to prohibit bad stuff from being online.” They’re both, not surprisingly, sued for defamation based on third-party content.

>CompuServe’s lawsuit is dismissed because what the judge says is, yeah, CompuServe is the electronic equivalent of a newsstand or bookstore. The court rules that Prodigy doesn’t get the same immunity because Prodigy actually did moderate content, so Prodigy is more like a newspaper’s letter to the editor page. So you get this really weird rule where these online platforms can reduce their liability by not moderating content.

There is precedent, but you are right in that the whole space has been allowed to act unchalleneged for so long. This is something that needs to change and we need a modern precedent to point at.

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#446

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yet I don't recall anyone questioning Buzzfeed News when they dropped their bombshell story years back. I remember the defenders saying something along the lines of "If the news is newsworthy and constitutes journalism, then the publication it was produced in shouldn't matter" As HN audience mostly claim to be full of "independent thinkers" we should have no problem with this being published by the Post if it indeed…

Buzzfeed was previously famous for apolitical clickbait articles and quizzes, they practically invented the genre. New York Post, meanwhile, has been a tabloid-level spreader of pro-conservative and anti-progressive misinformation. It's smart to be skeptical of obviously politically motivated reporting from any outlet, but especially so when one has such a concerning track record.

It's hilarious to me that the Post is now viewed as pro conservative. Framing the Post as pro-conservative is like calling Joe Rogan alt right. Finding some of the progressivism that has performed a hostile takeover of the democratic party hilarious, contradictory, and satire-friendly automatically makes you pro-conservative.

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#447

I don't pay for twitter, I don't have any reasonable expectations for a SLA regarding anything including DMs. Just like I have no responsibility to listen to people on soapboxes on street corners, and soap companies have no responsibility to provide soapboxes to anyone to shout from.

To think that your personal transactionality with Twitter, whether you pay for your SLAs or DMs etc, is what matters here is myopic at best. Because this soapbox found itself to be used at planet scale, 24/7 available and proven to be increasingly influential, even consequential, on our institutions that depend on healthy public discourse. Not only your analogy doesn’t follow, trying to apply market based normativities on problems of democratic processes is very misleading.

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#448
post #54

There's a recurring argument on social media censorship that goes: "you wouldn't want the telephone company censoring phone conversations would you?" And the response is along the lines: "these are hardly private conversations, any tweet can go viral and be seen by millions". This story breaks that mold in that it involves social media censoring private conversations via DM. If you think that's OK for Twitter on its…

I really hope AT&T starts censoring these damn spam calls. I've had 5 today.

Truecaller works even though the app is hard to stomach privacy-wise.

Google recently unveiled plans for its "verified calls" feature, so that might help if you're on an Android 11 device.

I personally do not answer any calls from numbers not on my contact list. If a call was urgent, I'd normally recieve a text message (if informal) or an email (if formal, like the bank, for example) from the caller eventually.

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#449

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Assuming you're from America - your right is absolutely bugfuck insane and blatantly corrupt and the fact that you're talking about them as if they're not seriously affects my ability to take you seriously. What is with all these people talking as if the American right and left are just two regular sides of the same political coin without addressing the massive elephant (pun not intended) in the room.

Thanks for the reply I guess, and the clear reminder why so many had to die both in NA and Europe for the first amendment to become a reality.

It's ironic to be championing the virtues of free speech in reply to a completely innocuous post that was flagged to death.

Re: Facebook, Twitter block the NY Post from posting

#450
post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There won't be legislative blow back, the GOP is days away from being wholesale evicted from controlling anything at all in DC. As a legislative move, this is changing their bet to the horse that's about to win. The social media companies are clearly more afraid longterm of what happens if they let this kind of stunt spread than they are afraid of the lame duck.

What makes you think that the Dems wouldn't like to make social media companies liable for misinfo? That's what I'm trying to say, here. Either way you slice it, 230 is in the crosshairs, it's just a matter of who's holding the gun and for what purpose. I also wouldn't bet a cent of my own money on the GOP being "wholesale evicted". I heard very similar, equally confident talk in 2016.

Democrats haven’t been raising 230 regulation though, that’s been republicans disgruntled that their ads had been fact-checked (by partisan conservatives, it turns out). The proposed regulations coming out of the house have been more about competition and anti-monopoly.

It’s hard to see this as anything more than an attempt to change their bet on a losing horse in this race, as the commenter you replied to pointed out.

And I’m not sure if we’re remembering the same 2016 election. We’re both talking about the same election, that resulted in the largest win for an American political party in history, right? 2016 was absolutely horrendous for conservatives and their saving grace was the senate cycle was particularly bad for democrats. If there’s a similar performance this election there’s a good chance that they take both branches.

Post reply on HN