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Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

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Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#441

Post by paloaltokid »

zelly wrote: post #394

Main benefits of Kubernetes: • Lets companies brag about having # many production services at any given time • Company saves money by not having to hire Linux sysadmins • Company saves money by not having to pay for managed cloud products if they don't want to • Declarative, version controlled, git-blameable deployments • Treating cloud providers like cattle not pets It's going to eat the world (already has?). I was…

I've never coded in C++, so I'm curious - what is the feedback loop like? My understanding is that since C++ is a compiled language, you can't "hit refresh" the same way you can in JavaScript/Ruby/etc.

Is that an incorrect understanding? I know C++ is supposed to be great for performance, but in truth I've never needed anything to be that fast. And if I can get the job done just as well with something I already know, I won't bother learning something like C++ which has a reputation for not being approachable.

But maybe I don't have full context?

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#442

Post by aspenmayer »

nwatson wrote: post #437
cortesoft wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Setting up one is easy. Setting up one that gives multiple separate teams the ability to configure their services, and apply those changes to servers around the world and in different environments, repeatedly and safely, is harder.

We just spent months at my workplace working on a system to reliably define and configure a set of parallel silo'ed integrated datastores, services, and network stack within Kubernetes/ISTIO (and AWS), and to reliably upgrade new software revisions within those silos and to account for the changing "shape" of the configuration/content in these silos. It's repeatable and safe now, but it took a lot of effort.

Is any of your new stack open sourced?

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#443

Post by mrweasel »

0xEFF wrote: post #399
ransom1538 wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just running docker-compose on load balanced machines is pretty close to having all k8s features (that would give you an endpoint, scaling, running pods[containers],heartbeats and nodes[vms]). If you run Kubernetes on GCP you will see it's just a wrapper of GCP vms, load balancers, instance groups and disks. EG: GCP k8's autoscaling for the nodes isn't any better than just simple GCP load balancers and instance group…

It’s pretty close to get it up and running. It’s not close to operating. You have to roll your own load balancer, health checks, method of updating and managing the underlying nodes, you don’t have operators or guarantees about the control plane, etc... Spin up a K8S in any major cloud provider and you get all this with a consistent API, which is where the value lies.

You have to do all those things, minus the load balancer, with Kubernetes. It’s only if you don’t run on-premise Kubernetes that really start to se benefits.

Honestly, as an ops guy, I would prefer to get up at 3AM do deal with a failed VM or load balancer, compared to dealing with any kind of failure in a Kubernetes cluster at 10AM.

I can understand wanting to be able to deploy to Kubernetes, it’s extremely flexible and relatively easy. But managing and debugging Kubernetes is still a nightmare, even just monitoring it correctly isn’t exactly easy.

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#444

Post by jjjensen90 »

pnako wrote: post #371
jjjensen90 wrote: post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are completely wrong. It is trivial to have your k8s control plane and your workload cluster in something like an ASG, and basically know nothing about the nodes in either group. I'm not even using GKS or EKS, just ASGs on AWS. My servers and applications are cattle, not pets. I knew literally nothing about k8s in September and now I have multiple clusters humming along, treating the worker cluster nodes as a gen…

I don't have a horse in this nonsense but I find it hilarious that even users of Kubeanraenet have some trouble defining what it even is.

No trouble, it is a system that can do many things and has many optional pieces. It is fundamentally a cloud native orchestration system.

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#445

Post by tluyben2 »

StavrosK wrote: post #319
vbezhenar wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's wrong with logging in to a server? I love logging in to a server and tinkering with it. Sure, for those who operate fleets of hundreds it's not scalable, but for a few servers that's a pleasure.

The problem is when you need to duplicate that server or restore it due to some error, you have no idea what all the changes you made are. Besides, it's additional hassle and a chance for things to go wrong, the way I have it set up now is that production gets a new deployment whenever something gets pushed to master and I don't have to do anything else.

But this is a solved problem since... well, at least since the beginning of internet. I managed 1000s of Linux & BSD systems over the past 25 years and I have scripts that do all that since the mid 90s that automate everything. I never install anything manual; if I have to do something new, I first write + test a script to do that remotely. Also, all this 'containerization' is not new; I have been using debootstrap/chroot since around that time as well. I run cleanly separated multiple versions of legacy (it is a bit scary how much time it takes to move something written early 2000s to a modern Linux version) + modern applications without any (hosting/reproducibility) issues since forever (in internet years anyway).

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#446

Post by rooam-dev »

sev wrote: post #177
tristor wrote: post #118

The simple answer is that Kubernetes isn't really any of the things it's been described as. What it /is/, though, is an operating system for the Cloud. It's a set of universal abstraction layers that can sit on top of and work with any IaaS provider and allows you to build and deploy applications using infrastructure-as-code concepts through a standardized and approachable API. Most companies who were late on the Clo…

I think this is a good answer. I'll add that as soon as you need to do something slightly more complex, without something like k8s you aren't going to be happy with your life. With k8s, it's almost a 1 liner. For example, adding a load balancer or a network volume or nginx or an SSL cert or auto scaling or...or...or...

Any competent engineer without experience is more likely to figure out how setup and/or troubleshoot nginx than kubernetes.

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#447

Post by zomglings »

closeparen wrote: post #369
bradgessler wrote: post #341

I’ll take a shot. k8s is popular because Docker solved a real problem and Compose didn’t move fast enough to solve orchestration problem. It’s a second order effect; the important thing is Docker’s popularity. Before Docker there were a lot of different solutions for software developers to package up their web applications to run on a server. Docker kind of solved that problem: ops teams could theoretically take anyt…

>Before Docker there were a lot of different solutions for software developers to package up their web applications to run on a server. There are basically two relevant package managers. And say what you will about systemd, service units are easy to write. It's weird to me that the tooling for building .deb packages and hosting them in a private Apt repository is so crusty and esoteric. Structurally these things "sho…

Which two package managers do you mean?

dpkg, rpm, nix, snap, dnf, and I'm sure someone is going to respond with package managers I forgot.

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#448

Post by edwinyzh »

zelly wrote: post #394

Main benefits of Kubernetes: • Lets companies brag about having # many production services at any given time • Company saves money by not having to hire Linux sysadmins • Company saves money by not having to pay for managed cloud products if they don't want to • Declarative, version controlled, git-blameable deployments • Treating cloud providers like cattle not pets It's going to eat the world (already has?). I was…

or a Free Pascal server (powered by mORMot (https://github.com/synopse/mORMot))? Natively compiled, high performance, and supports almost all OS's and CPU's

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#449

Post by zomglings »

StavrosK wrote: post #245
wolco wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Curious why run it at all? The cost must be 10 times more this way. It is mostly for the fun of learning. I come from the opposite approach. I have 4 servers two digital ocean $5 and two vulr $2.50 instances. One holds the db. One server as the frontend/code. One server to do heavy work and another to server a heavy site and holds backups. For $15 I'm hosting hundreds of sites, running so many background processes. I…

How do you do automated deployments, though? I don't like using K8s for small stuff, but I am also extremely allergic to having to log on to a server to do anything. Dokku hits the sweet spot for me, but at work I would probably use Nomad instead.

Write a script which runs remotely over SSH and trigger on the appropriate event in your CI/CD host.

Re: Why is Kubernetes getting so popular?

#450

Post by danielovichdk »

zelly wrote: post #394

Main benefits of Kubernetes: • Lets companies brag about having # many production services at any given time • Company saves money by not having to hire Linux sysadmins • Company saves money by not having to pay for managed cloud products if they don't want to • Declarative, version controlled, git-blameable deployments • Treating cloud providers like cattle not pets It's going to eat the world (already has?). I was…

Absolutely agree.

A lot of people is just really interested in having something complex instead of understanding their actual needs.

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