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Is the era of the $100 graphing calculator coming to an end?

thehustle.co

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Re: Is the era of the $100 graphing calculator coming to an end?

#441
post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And absolutely killed the absolute best engineering calculator to ever exist--the HP48SX. I still use all my HP calculators from the 80's and early 90's. It's all about the keyboard. I can enter enormous streams of numbers and operators and never miss .

I worked for the HP calculator back in the early 90s. It was the first generation HP calculator that is looking to using new keyboard technology. The amount engineering effort to keep the tactile feedback was significant. It had to be just the right amount of click as well as the amount of pressure needed to make the contact. The tactile feedback on the HP calculators is one of the those things that defined that prod…

If you don't mind my asking: what was the "old" generation technology?

It seems like with modern manufacturing we ought to be able to replicate that.

Re: Is the era of the $100 graphing calculator coming to an end?

#442

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had an 84 in high school and didn't even hide that I was doing this and didn't consider it cheating. The way I see it, if you understand the material well enough to program a computer to do it then you have understood the material. Not allowing me to make and use my own automation tool is just artificial difficulty. Now the kids who only used the program function to hide notes, those kids were cheaters. To this day…

This is somewhat fair, but the programs are also shareable. So if you s shared your program, presumably others could have the advantage without having understood the material

My classes got around this by teaching how to make a TI84 quadratic solver program a short part of the curriculum. Introduced the students to the concept of building tools to help yourself pretty well. Most people didn't get programming because it was such a shallow dip into the field, but it sparked a couple minds. I had already done that basically a year earlier, when I had my programming awakening, so I did a lot of helping and after the lesson handing out my improved version of the code, as well as a self-made game

Re: Is the era of the $100 graphing calculator coming to an end?

#443

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Back when I was in calc, you actually had to show your work, so a calculator was pointless.

I was in HS in the early 2000s and graphing calculator programs were advanced enough to show you the work on the way to the answer. You'd just copy the steps onto paper. Especially useful for blitzing homework.

Those calculators were much more expensive than the already crazy expensive TI-84 that I had. When I got to college/calculus and actually started struggling with math a bit, I learned how to use the ability of calculators to check work or solve the end product to re-derive a method or otherwise help guide me. It didn't always work, but once or twice it was the key to helping me get an answer and process

Re: Is the era of the $100 graphing calculator coming to an end?

#444
post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is no reason for any math course at any level to ever need a calculator, period. Numerical methods courses need calculators for questions about practice rather than theory. Basic (non-graphing) cheap ones are usually sufficient, though. I think slide rules are thoroughly obsolete in almost every context. There's no point in wasting students' time when better tools are available.

None of the professional numerical analysts I know work with a handheld calculator. The point of learning a slide rule is not that it is a particularly important practical tool, but that understanding how it works has independent pedagogical value. If someone built their own electronic calculator from discrete components, programmed one on an FPGA, or even implemented a bunch of mathematical functions on an existing…

Professionals don't, but students need to, especially in study groups, tutorials, tests, and exams, when computers are not available. Calculators are also much more approachable than computers for this material for students with no programming knowledge.

The point of using a calculator is to skip over the tedious unimportant details when learning other things e.g. Newton's method or Euler's method. The calculator itself is a tool, not an educational destination.

Learning a slide rule as you say makes sense in a history of maths course, and implementing one's own calculator makes sense in an electronics or computer science course.

Re: Is the era of the $100 graphing calculator coming to an end?

#445
post #7

This can be summed up pretty easily. The TI graphing calculator has no internet access and no ability to store notes. Neither ability can be easily added. As long as that is the case, they will win, because the test companies don't want to deal with people having internet access and notes. Now if Apple/Android made a simple way for a test proctor to put your phone into a single app only that you couldn't easily break…

I sort of get banning internet access but I've always been baffled at exams not allowing notes. At least in engineering, we should encourage students to be able to solve difficult problems with notes rather than solve minimal ones with barely memorized formulas and phrases.

Answer keys, among other elements.

Contrast a single A-4 / US Letter, or 3x5 or 4x6 index card.

Re: Is the era of the $100 graphing calculator coming to an end?

#446
post #444

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of the professional numerical analysts I know work with a handheld calculator. The point of learning a slide rule is not that it is a particularly important practical tool, but that understanding how it works has independent pedagogical value. If someone built their own electronic calculator from discrete components, programmed one on an FPGA, or even implemented a bunch of mathematical functions on an existing…

Professionals don't, but students need to, especially in study groups, tutorials, tests, and exams, when computers are not available. Calculators are also much more approachable than computers for this material for students with no programming knowledge. The point of using a calculator is to skip over the tedious unimportant details when learning other things e.g. Newton's method or Euler's method. The calculator its…

Computers are plenty available in “study groups and tutorials” (for one thing almost all college students and many high school students now have smartphones, and most college students also have laptops and/or tablets, but if you want a cheap computer just for math class, get a netbook or cheap android tablet and external keyboard or something made from a raspberry pi or ....)

There’s really not much pedagogical value in using a handheld calculator to apply Newton’s method to some root-finding problem or apply Euler’s method (forward differences) to model a differential equation. Both of these are very simple and students can learn enough of some simple programming language to implement them both in a very short amount of time. That time is much better spent than doing 4 or 5 examples of each with a handheld calculator. If a general-purpose programming language seems too much, get them implementing these simple tools in desmos or geogebra.

On a timed in-class exam in an introductory calculus course, there are much better ways of judging someone’s understanding than making them perform a bunch of tedious and error-prone number crunching. (For example you could give the students rulers and printed graphs of a function – without any symbolic expression written down – and ask them to sketch approximately what a solution using Newton’s method would look like).

If you want a nice introductory calculus book organized along more computer-focused and conceptual lines, take a look at http://www.math.smith.edu/~callahan/intromine.html

In a post-introductory-calculus “numerical analysis” course, the exams should consist of writing proofs, not performing algorithms.

The important thing for numerical analysts about different root-finding methods (etc.) is their convergence speed, numerical stability, computational complexity, and so on. In the 1960s and before it might have made sense to get students performing the role of human computer, but nowadays it is anachronistic.

> Learning a slide rule as you say makes sense in a history of maths course

No, learning how to use a slide rule makes sense in an algebra course for ~15-year-old secondary math students who are learning about logarithms, and for 15–17-year-old secondary science students. They’ll end up with a better intuitive understanding of logarithms and significant digits and error bounds after regularly using a slide rule for even a few weeks than any amount of reading about it or doing formal algebraic manipulation.

Electronic calculators give students a very misleading impression that all of the digits printed on its display are meaningful. But in high school chemistry, physics, etc. courses there is pretty much no experiment ever done with better than about 2 digits of precision.

Re: Is the era of the $100 graphing calculator coming to an end?

#447
post #385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Now the math department? They were a different story. No calculators. Period. Ever. Made higher-level calculus... interesting. There is no reason for any math course at any level to ever need a calculator, period. The point of math courses is learning to think, not learning to avoid fat-fingering tiny buttons or learning the specific crappy interface of some anachronistic antique machine. Without an electronic calc…

I like mathematics that's about concepts and understanding. But numbers are a big part of some mathematics too. And getting some help with them can be useful. Lots of our past mathematical geniuses were great at calculating by hand. And some of them even invented some mechanical calculators (or electronic ones, too).

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Re: Is the era of the $100 graphing calculator coming to an end?

#448
post #422
post #418

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lots of prisons have dress codes for visitors of prisoners banning visitors from certain kinds of clothing. On the banned list of items, you will never see Burberry tweed or men's sport coats, but rather t-shirts, types of shorts or other clothes poor people wear (often called "trashy" clothing). It's about shame and control.

The link below shows a cross section of expensive designer fashion, exclusively for rich people. Almost all of it would be banned by prison dress codes. https://duckduckgo.com/?q=expensive+designer+fashion+runway&...

Now I'm just picturing catwalk models marching into a prison dressed like that. Like a scene from Zoolander. :-)

Re: Is the era of the $100 graphing calculator coming to an end?

#449
post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There would be no difference other than acting it out on a physical board (as well).

True, but I still don't get what grandparent was talking about. Comparing Elo ratings of what why?

Of your account that plays with the aid of a chess engine and the one where you play unaided.

Re: Is the era of the $100 graphing calculator coming to an end?

#450

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True, but I still don't get what grandparent was talking about. Comparing Elo ratings of what why?

Of your account that plays with the aid of a chess engine and the one where you play unaided.

Oh okay, right. Well yes hypothetically if there was such a rule, yes you could do that. But there never will be such a rule so I have never and will never play with computer assistance. On Lichess or over the board or anywhere else. And even hypothetically I am not sure what the point would be of proceeding as you suggest. Obviously I would be better with the computer assistance and have a higher Elo. But only once I got my engine up to be much stronger than me (otherwise there'd be no point in bothering).
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