When i read things like that i feel like i really screwed up !
i have a PhD in Computer Science (in one of the hot Topics: Machine Learning !!!) and here in Germany i only earn 95k € / year with 8 years experience :(
Silicon Valley Software Engineer Salaries by Experience Level
441–450 of 455 posts
Re: Silicon Valley Software Engineer Salaries by Experience Level
#442Coming from Germany, these salaries often feel crazy to me. Is this because owning real estate is such a big deal in the US?
i second this ! i have a PhD in CS (Topic : Machine Learning !!!) i only earn ~95k / year with 8 years experience
Re: Silicon Valley Software Engineer Salaries by Experience Level
#443Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I understand that it’s hard to compare non-salary compensation. But these figures give the impression that compensation for a Bay Area software engineer is shockingly lower than the reality. RSUs and bonuses at established companies will easily double your take home pay. I agree with your overall message, but base salary itself is very important. That's what puts a roof over your family's head and food on the table…
At large tech companies, RSUs and bonuses aren't that different than cash.
Once they're vested and settled, I agree. But because they must vest and settle, and can be awarded (or not) on discretionary grounds, they're closer to found money than they are salary in my budget. IMHO, it's bad personal finance to put yourself in a position where a missed bonus or stock event can screw up your daily finances.
Re: Silicon Valley Software Engineer Salaries by Experience Level
#444Earlier quoted context omitted.
But software programmers don't qualify for TN visa. System analyst is the closes I think.
Wrong. You just need to phrase it the right way. The government bureaucracy considers programmers as typists, and systems analysts as programmers.
And if the border guard doesn't like the wording, they'll reject you at the border.
Re: Silicon Valley Software Engineer Salaries by Experience Level
#445Earlier quoted context omitted.
London is a weird market. Don't believe the incredibly low salaries you see on Glassdoor. There seems to be a handful of places that have reasonable salaries. I don't fully understand why contract pays so much higher. One interesting thing in London is many (most?) permanent roles have a two or even three month contractual "notice period". So if you hand in your notice, you're stuck working for another three months.…
I've only ever served out one-month notice periods. If i'd been a bit more senior at my last job, it might have been two. Where i am now is four and a half months or something insane like that.
Curious why did you take it? Did you try negotiating it down to something reasonable? (two weeks to a month)
Re: Silicon Valley Software Engineer Salaries by Experience Level
#446Earlier quoted context omitted.
I've only ever served out one-month notice periods. If i'd been a bit more senior at my last job, it might have been two. Where i am now is four and a half months or something insane like that.
Curious why did you take it? Did you try negotiating it down to something reasonable? (two weeks to a month)
Getting a copy of the actual contract, with the notice period in, was fairly late in the process, after i'd already informally accepted the offer. I didn't think i had a lot of leverage to get it changed. I could have tried, but by BATNA [1] was taking another job i wanted less, whilst their BATNA was to keep looking for candidates they liked just as much. Perhaps i underestimated the strength of my hand.
I'm also not all that bothered about it. I've never decided to quit a job and needed to be out one month later - i am not the sort of person who bumps into someone founding a hot new startup and decides to jump on board. Four and a half months sounds like about the amount of time it would take me to find a new job anyway!
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Best_alternative_to_a_negotiat...
Re: Silicon Valley Software Engineer Salaries by Experience Level
#447Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm not sure how laws like that help if an employer has access to information about past salary so they don't have to ask. There is an Equifax service that keeps track of past jobs to some extent. It isn't necessarily accurate or complete, but it exists - https://www.theworknumber.com/
It’s not legal to use in California after the bill becomes law. (b) An employer shall not, orally or in writing, personally or through an agent, seek salary history information, including compensation and benefits, about an applicant for employment
Interesting. I wonder whether the word "seek" instead of "obtain" or "utilize" is a loophole.
Re: Silicon Valley Software Engineer Salaries by Experience Level
#448Earlier quoted context omitted.
Working for below market rates is putting skin in the game.
It is not. It is just a deal worse than average, not necessarily when it's possible to get a better deal (it's not that the early employees in startups are all rock stars, many just can't get a job in a better place). Putting skin in the game is: * paying from your own wallet when there's a cash shortage * being mentally prepared to have guns pointed at you and your personal assets for violating an obscure regulation…
> paying from your own wallet when there's a cash shortage
What's the difference between donating half your paycheck to the company, and only being given half your paychecks?
> being mentally prepared to have guns pointed at you and your personal assets for violating an obscure regulation No. 389343A, or just attacked by employees, investors, partners for whatever reason they can come up with
VCs don't need to deal with the former. You don't get attacked in the case of the latter, you just get fired.
> being a face of a commercial entity and putting your reputation at stake. Most people on this planet don't see a difference between a billion dollar corporation and a penniless startup, and assume all companies are powerful and have unlimited funds. Hence, their key people are to be hated and mistrusted.
VCs make bad investments and founders make bad decisions all the time. The valley does not hold it against them for long.
> and, last but not least, being prepared to be woken up at any given minute to fix an issue of any nature
Here's where you're wrong - in a startup, engineers are the ones who get woken up at any given minute to fix an issue of any nature. Investors sure aren't.
Re: Silicon Valley Software Engineer Salaries by Experience Level
#449Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'd be more interested in a guild or craft association than a union. I don't find collective bargaining, closed shops, standardized pay schedules, and some other features of unions to be compelling.
Agree. I'd much rather we organize the same way lawyers with their Bar Associations operate.
Bit of a nitpick, but I'd rather we organize like actuaries rather than lawyers. A rigorous exam is fine, but I think it's important to keep multiple educational paths open. I'd hate to see a single accredited degree path as the only option for licensing[1].
In short, a math major with a CS emphasis should be allowed to take the exam. Or, in my opinion, even someone who is just really great at self study.
[1] I know, there are some alternative paths in law, but still very limited.
Re: Silicon Valley Software Engineer Salaries by Experience Level
#450Earlier quoted context omitted.
For what it's worth, for a lot of the types of software roles out there, many of them only have existed in their current forms for 10 years is incredibly rare, so to even find someone who has been doing mobile programming for 5 years should be enough to call them senior given they have been working in the field for half of the time the modern concepts have been around.
There are still many concepts that transcend the specific language / platform. As I've become more attuned to this I'm sometimes horrified by code that supposedly senior engineers write that egregiously violate separation of concerns, for example. An experienced developer who knows how to properly design and architect software should be able to jump ahead of a less experienced developer who has more years experience…
I agree, so maybe mobile is a bad example, but look at how different the field of data infrastructure is today than it was ten years ago. While yes, many of the old concepts still exist. A person who worked with big data for 5 years with modern distributed systems is likely more skilled in this space than someone who spent the last 10 years doing ETL jobs linking standard sql databases to columnar stores.