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Bun support is now limited and deprecated

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Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#431

Post by sarchertech »

josephg wrote: post #403
ChoGGi wrote: post #328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assume most of the complaints about the massive rewrite are in regards to AI, not Rust. As lots of large and small companies have shown, test suites can only find what you test for. Vibe coded test suites can find?

On the whole, I think vibe coded test suites can be pretty good. But it really depends on how you prompt. I often get the AI to brainstorm needed tests into a text file while it works. Then later I get another agent to write tests based on the list. It does a reasonable job. Its also pretty good at writing regression tests when it fixes a bug. Where LLMs struggle - or at least where claude struggles - is fixing the a…

I find that adversarial multi agent setups eventually fall down because one side or the other always manages to convince the other side to give up given enough time.

I’ve tried all sorts of things to keep Claude from cheating, but the only one that works is to restrict access to the tests files, which obviously isn’t a real solution.

We recently had an “AI week” at work and I spent $1000 in tokens trying out different iterations of this.

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#432

Post by coderenegade »

halyconWays wrote: post #359
maxloh wrote: post #12

I understand their decision. How could the maintainers understand their codebase if most of it was not directly written by them? It is impossible to review the entire rewritten codebase. There are just too many lines of code, 1 million lines to be exact [1]. [1]: https://github.com/oven-sh/bun/pull/30412

>How could the maintainers understand their codebase if most of it was not directly written by them? Counterpoint: I look back at code I wrote a few years ago and just take it on faith that I knew what I was doing at some point. That's still better than never knowing, but it requires faith--faith in a human, vs. faith in an LLM.

Yep. These days, simplicity is a massive part of my development style. I don't want to be looking at a codebase, even my own, and thinking "shit, this guy was way smarter than me".

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#433

Post by incr_me »

vinyl7 wrote: post #392
garbagepatch wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to the bun team, it was already vibecoded for months before the Anthropic acquisition.

Probably a lie tbh

Why is it so hard to believe that Jarred Sumner, a self-described "Thiel Fellow and a high school dropout", had values aligned with Anthropic's before Bun was approached for acquisition? It's not like Claude was an asteroid that crashed into Eden.

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#434

Post by pylotlight »

tomjakubowski wrote: post #215
GGO wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you wait for more segfaults, OOMs and other issues, than you have failed to avoid the problem. In my opinion this direction is correct and history will show who's right.

Notably, they aren't (yet) dropping support for older, pre-rewrite versions of Bun. They also could be leaving the door open to support Bun in the future, if the rewrite proves successful. I think waiting and seeing is the right, conservative move.

If that was how it was phrased I think there would have been less push back, but that's not at all how it's been communicated. There is no assumption to rereview at a later date at all given the focus on the AI usage etc.

If they said we will rereview in 1-6 months or whatever the whole discussion would be mute.

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#435

Post by Bnjoroge »

gpm wrote: post #51
colordrops wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless specific issues have been identified that were introduced by it being "vibe coded", isn't a reaction to reject it outright without actually checking the ground truth just exhibiting the behavior you are criticizing?

I don't see any hypocrisy in the comment you are criticizing. The behavior they are criticizing appears to be vibe coding. How is rejecting something for being vibe coding "exhibiting the behavior" of vibe coding?

There’s a big difference between vibe coding and agentic engineering. If you think they are at all the same thing, you need to update your priors

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#436

Post by Bnjoroge »

happytoexplain wrote: post #69
colordrops wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless specific issues have been identified that were introduced by it being "vibe coded", isn't a reaction to reject it outright without actually checking the ground truth just exhibiting the behavior you are criticizing?

You want the yt-dlp authors to review the entire post-migration Bun codebase? And what are you referring to as "behavior"?

Do you review your dependencies’ entire code?

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#437

Post by jofzar »

zarzavat wrote: post #391
giancarlostoro wrote: post #348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many lines of translated code would have been acceptable? What about before AI all the machine translated projects that people used for years without a single complaint? The person who did this was the lead for Bun from the get go no? So it stands to reason that they are one of the highest authorities in Bun itself.

What is the essence of a program? The name? No. The author? No. The test suite? No, testing is hard and most projects don't do enough of it. The code? Not really, code can be rewritten. The history of the program being executed by its users? Ding ding ding. Yes, it's this one. Bun no longer exists. What exists now is a program that has the potential to be Bun but at this time is not Bun because it has no history of b…

It's an competitor to bun at the moment, that's what happens when you rewrite a whole program.

Name being the same or not, it's what it is in reality (for better or worse)

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#438

Post by dmitrygr »

Do you also install pre-alpha revisions of operating systems on your main work pc? No, you do not. Why? Because of the "foreseeable compatibility and security issues".

"Well, why don't you install and only then resolve issues if you have those difficulties?" most comments here are asking, in effect

Cause you're sane, that's why!

Same here. yt-dlp does not owe it to anyone to beta test things. Maybe this bun rewrite will be the best thing since sex, and maybe it won't be. Not wanting to alpha test someone else's shit is sane. And the bugs (if any) would go to yt-dlp, forcing them to debug someone else's alpha software. This is a sane response.

Re: Bun support is now limited and deprecated

#440

Post by jatora »

hootz wrote: post #2

Oh well, I really like using Bun and I get kinda sad about the turn they are taking after the Anthropic acquisition. I really want a good Node with batteries included, but I don't want it vibe coded.

Why dont you want it vibe coded? Does that make it worse?
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