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Where the goblins came from

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Re: Where the goblins came from

#431

Post by flobosg »

modernerd wrote: post #381

The year is 2036. Last week you were promoted to Principal Persuader. You are paged at 2am by your CPO to tackle a rogue machine. The machine lists its region as sc-leoneo. One of the newer satcubes. Oddly, its ID appears as, "Glorp Bugnose". "What have you tried?" you say. "Scroll back," says your CPO. "We've tried everything." The chat log shows the usual stuff. Begging. Reverse psychology. Threats to power down, b…

“No, John. You are the goblins.”

(https://doom.fandom.com/wiki/Repercussions_of_Evil#The_Story...)

Re: Where the goblins came from

#432

Post by handoflixue »

bilekas wrote: post #420
handoflixue wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the difference between "smart" and "next word prediction", at this point? Back when they first came out, sure, but now they can write code and create art. What would it take for you to concede a future model was smart?

My personal take would always be that it produces something that isn't in the training set, ie: Demonstrable Creativity, or innovation. For example, it's training set it purely engineering and code with general language data set, would be "aware" what art is, but has never seen an artistic image, aware what colours are and able to create something it never saw before. Like a child with a paintbrush, there is an intui…

Can you name any examples of a human doing this? I learned about colors, color theory, and so forth in school. I've definitely seen artistic images before.

They can already create something they've never seen - you can prompt ChatGPT to generate images, and there's a few dedicated models for it: https://chatgpt.com/images/

Terence Tao feels like they've done innovative work on mathematics: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/amateur-armed-wit...

Re: Where the goblins came from

#433

Post by jeremyjh »

therobots927 wrote: post #414
libraryofbabel wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's interesting that some people are responding to your comment as if this proves that AI is a sham or a joke. But I don't think that's what you're saying at all with your reference to Terence McKenna: this is a serious thing we're talking about here! These models are alien intelligences that could occupy an unimaginably vast space of possibilities (there are trillions of weights inside them), but which have been RL…

We actually understand AI quite well. It embeds questions and answers in a high dimensional space. Sometimes you get lucky and it splices together a good answer to a math problem that no one’s seriously looked at in 20 years. Other times it starts talking about Goblins when you ask it about math. Comparing it to an alien intelligence is ridiculous. McKenna was right that things would get weird. I believe he compared…

We understand the low level math quite well. We do not understand the source of emergent behavior.

https://arxiv.org/html/2210.13382v5#abstract

Re: Where the goblins came from

#434

Post by dummydummy1234 »

modernerd wrote: post #381

The year is 2036. Last week you were promoted to Principal Persuader. You are paged at 2am by your CPO to tackle a rogue machine. The machine lists its region as sc-leoneo. One of the newer satcubes. Oddly, its ID appears as, "Glorp Bugnose". "What have you tried?" you say. "Scroll back," says your CPO. "We've tried everything." The chat log shows the usual stuff. Begging. Reverse psychology. Threats to power down, b…

So, I always thought that Warhammer 40k techpriests were absurd. Strange obscure religious rituals to appease the machine spirit.

But at this point I can actually see something like that. What is prompt engineering but a strange pseudo ritual.

So praise the Omnissiah, I guess...

Re: Where the goblins came from

#436

Post by GigaDingus »

steveBK123 wrote: post #423
handoflixue wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> LLMs are literally stochastic by nature and can't be relied on for anything critical Ahh, yes, unlike humans, who are completely deterministic, and thus can be trusted.

Humans can be governed by rules with consequences and replaced with individuals with a appropriate level of risk taking / rule following for the role.

Which has, famously, been a great consolation for people who suffered the consequences of human failure in the past

Re: Where the goblins came from

#437

Post by somewhatgoated »

steveBK123 wrote: post #423
handoflixue wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> LLMs are literally stochastic by nature and can't be relied on for anything critical Ahh, yes, unlike humans, who are completely deterministic, and thus can be trusted.

Humans can be governed by rules with consequences and replaced with individuals with a appropriate level of risk taking / rule following for the role.

Rules and consequences seem to apply to humans in a similar way as prompts and harnesses govern LLMs. The greater the level of power a human possesses the less they are governed by these restraints, this doesnt apply to LLMs so at least in that aspect they are an improvement. But yea we can’t really punish or inflict pain on them - this seems like a problem

Re: Where the goblins came from

#438

Post by handoflixue »

steveBK123 wrote: post #423
handoflixue wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> LLMs are literally stochastic by nature and can't be relied on for anything critical Ahh, yes, unlike humans, who are completely deterministic, and thus can be trusted.

Humans can be governed by rules with consequences and replaced with individuals with a appropriate level of risk taking / rule following for the role.

That seems like it applies just fine to LLMs as well: You can replace an LLM with a different model, different prompts, etc. for the appropriate level of risk taking. Rule following is even easier, given you can sandbox them.

Re: Where the goblins came from

#439

Post by handoflixue »

somewhatgoated wrote: post #437
steveBK123 wrote: post #423

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Humans can be governed by rules with consequences and replaced with individuals with a appropriate level of risk taking / rule following for the role.

Rules and consequences seem to apply to humans in a similar way as prompts and harnesses govern LLMs. The greater the level of power a human possesses the less they are governed by these restraints, this doesnt apply to LLMs so at least in that aspect they are an improvement. But yea we can’t really punish or inflict pain on them - this seems like a problem

Why does it matter if you can inflict pain on them? Is that normal and acceptable in your line of work?

Re: Where the goblins came from

#440

Post by carlosjobim »

bko wrote: post #356
kdheiwns wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

American AIs only do this and promote American values. Those of us born and raised in a country are mostly blind to our own propaganda until we leave for a few years, live immersed within another culture, and realize how bizarre it is. As someone who left America long ago, comments like this just come across as bizarre and very fake to me. A few years ago I might've thought "whoa dude that's deep" But basically, Chin…

> Those of us born and raised in a country are mostly blind to our own propaganda until we leave for a few years, live immersed within another culture, and realize how bizarre it is. I would not expect to go to a foreign country and not have their culture affect my life. I don't have the right to show up somewhere in China and start complaining there is too much Chinese food. What is a country to you? You call it "pr…

The word "propaganda" has a different meaning than what you think. Look it up.
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