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The dangers of California's legislation to censor 3D printing

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Re: The dangers of California's legislation to censor 3D printing

#431

Post by scarecrowbob »

marcus_holmes wrote: post #358
abeyer wrote: post #341

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Guns are much more likely to kill their owners than anyone else [0] That article says no such thing, despite people often claiming it does.

What do you think it says then?

The easy observation is that it's far more likely that guns simply do nothing than they are to kill anyone.

I am about 50, and I can tell the difference between when my mental health was in a place where I might kill myself and where I am now.

That makes the math around gun ownership a lot more straight forward- hoping that the bigots will off themselves before they start lynching folks again (because it wouldn't be the first time) doesn't seem like the safer bet.

I am glad you live in a place that has never been touched by bigots excited by war- clearly there is no way that in Europe the bigots have or will ever (again?) require local resistance fighting (right?).

Re: The dangers of California's legislation to censor 3D printing

#432

Post by forshaper »

jasonlotito wrote: post #280
elephanlemon wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any gun company caught funding anything remotely anti-2A would be met with an unbelievably negative reaction from the firearms community and face boycotts and massive reputational damage. It absolutely would not be worth it for them to do this. I can maybe see the arguments that perhaps it’s really a proxy for the anti right to repair groups, but absolutely not the firearms manufacturers.

> Any gun company caught funding anything remotely anti-2A would be met with an unbelievably negative reaction from the firearms community and face boycotts and massive reputational damage. This is not true. They currently fund people and policies that are 100% anti-2A without any pushback. It's just a matter of fooling the people into accepting the anti-2A stuff you do support.

Got an example or two?

Re: The dangers of California's legislation to censor 3D printing

#433

Post by SV_BubbleTime »

dlev_pika wrote: post #430
SV_BubbleTime wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Need? Get to. I get to carry and make sure that I’m not a useless decoration if I or my family is ever in trouble because of someone that shouldn’t be in general population. Need :) Ya, I see how you sell it to yourself as a negative.

I prefer a working police force, fewer rEsPoNsIbLe gUn oWnErs, and not to increase my, or my family’s, chances of dying by firearm, but I guess we all need to feel we are worth it, in one way or another - damned be the costs.

>I prefer a working police force

I prefer a utopia too. Until we get there that’s nice to have outsourced your safety to people that have no obligation to help you. I chose otherwise.

Re: The dangers of California's legislation to censor 3D printing

#434

Post by laughing_man »

elephanlemon wrote: post #263
iwontberude wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like everything in the United States, it’s actually gun manufacturers that want to clamp down on this cottage industry which threatens their profits. I don’t buy for a second that this is some gun control attempt.

Any gun company caught funding anything remotely anti-2A would be met with an unbelievably negative reaction from the firearms community and face boycotts and massive reputational damage. It absolutely would not be worth it for them to do this. I can maybe see the arguments that perhaps it’s really a proxy for the anti right to repair groups, but absolutely not the firearms manufacturers.

Yep. That's what happened when Smith & Wesson decided to back a scheme that would require some kind of system to prevent the gun from working if someone other than the owner was holding it. The then-current owners had to sell the company before the sales returned.

Re: The dangers of California's legislation to censor 3D printing

#435

Post by some_random »

AngryData wrote: post #355
elephanlemon wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any gun company caught funding anything remotely anti-2A would be met with an unbelievably negative reaction from the firearms community and face boycotts and massive reputational damage. It absolutely would not be worth it for them to do this. I can maybe see the arguments that perhaps it’s really a proxy for the anti right to repair groups, but absolutely not the firearms manufacturers.

I wish I could believe that but many people are perfectly okay with curtailing certain parts of rights so long as they aren't parts of a right they personally use or value. Plenty of pro-2a people were fine with gun control when it was being used to suppress the Black Panthers. And also many times to "fight crime" with specific firearm features and configurations being illegal despite not making anybody safer.

That was true, but largely is not true anymore. When Trump was pushing a blanket ban on trans people owning guns, gun rights organizations come out in force against (while anti-gun organizations like Everytown didn't).

Re: The dangers of California's legislation to censor 3D printing

#436

Post by [deleted] »

forshaper wrote: post #432
jasonlotito wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Any gun company caught funding anything remotely anti-2A would be met with an unbelievably negative reaction from the firearms community and face boycotts and massive reputational damage. This is not true. They currently fund people and policies that are 100% anti-2A without any pushback. It's just a matter of fooling the people into accepting the anti-2A stuff you do support.

Got an example or two?

[deleted]

Re: The dangers of California's legislation to censor 3D printing

#437

Post by some_random »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #376
alterom wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>You can easily go through a couple hundred rounds in one visit to the range. Range shooting is not what they're trying to legislate though. Whoever killed that healthcare CEO didn't need a hundred rounds. This legislation is insanely, horrendously bad and harmful, but "3D printed gun components are useless" isn't a solid argument against it. They're useful enough . The real arguments, as others said, are: 1. You can…

> Range shooting is not what they're trying to legislate though. It's the thing gun manufacturers are selling to their customer base though. The theory was they were lobbying for this to prevent competition, but it's not good enough to actually compete with them. > Whoever killed that healthcare CEO didn't need a hundred rounds. Luigi Mangione didn't have a criminal record. Given his apparent political alignment, he…

It comes back the same thing, there is zero evidence that gun manufacturers are lobbying for this while Everytown is very publicly and proudly announcing that they are pushing this exact legislation.

Re: The dangers of California's legislation to censor 3D printing

#438

Post by some_random »

master-lincoln wrote: post #414
Findecanor wrote: post #216

I used to do cosplay. Many costumes from movies, TV-series and anime are of characters that wield guns, often unique or at least quite distinctive guns. Carrying the correct gun is sometimes a thing that identifies the character, and therefore is an integral part of the cosplay. For example, I used to cosplay for charity in the Star Wars costuming club 501'st Legion [0], where for most costumes a blaster gun of high…

So that law would also diminish the glorification of weapons in pop culture then. I guess that would be seen as positive side effect for the people supporting this ban.

I really want to highlight this comment to everyone who's on the fence on gun rights or still believes that compromise is possible. This is the position of hardline anti-gun people, their billionaire funded NGOs, and the politicians they finance.

It's not about reducing excess death, it's not about gun violence, it's about abolishing all civilian firearms ownership and removing any positive association of firearms or self defense from the culture. There is no compromise possible because they will never be happy with anything less.

Re: The dangers of California's legislation to censor 3D printing

#439

Post by some_random »

c0rruptbytes wrote: post #211

Guns are legal, in fact building your own gun, may be the most legal thing in the history of the 2A - there's an enormous amount of "historical" context to back this It's such a waste of time and resources - you wanna handle gun violence? handle normal violence with proven mechanisms (education, social welfare, etc...)

Everytown doesn't actually care about gun violence, they want to end civilian firearms ownership entirely.

Re: The dangers of California's legislation to censor 3D printing

#440

Post by some_random »

fasterik wrote: post #239
hunterpayne wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't follow politics in CA very closely if you think that. The way it works in CA is that the party makes sure that only 1 candidate runs in the Dem primary. Then they gerrymander the districts to make sure that they know which party will win in which district. The result of this is that the party insiders choose the politicians, not the voters. PS Nobody in their right mind thinks the Dems support civil liberti…

According to the Princeton Gerrymandering project, California's districts are better than average, with some bias. You can see a map of the entire U.S. on their front page. https://gerrymander.princeton.edu/ Before the recent wave of gerrymandering started by Texas, California had an independent, non-partisan redistricting committee. Could you provide a source for the claim that before 2025, there was significant ger…

I don't know how this value is calculated but a glance at the districts immediately tells me that it's full of shit.

https://gerrymander.princeton.edu/redistricting-report-card/...

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