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US orders diplomats to fight data sovereignty initiatives

reuters.com

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Re: US orders diplomats to fight data sovereignty initiatives

#431

Post by deaux »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #410
deaux wrote: post #409

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Data sovereignty is almost the default in Korea and common in Japan. It has been a common idea there for decades, in fact there are laws about it. The big corps there were plenty familiar with the CLOUD Act and such many years ago when 99.9% of EU corps couldn't give less of a shit. Percentages are completely different. Joining of a forum is meaningless in itself, the actual actions of the governments and businesses…

Joining a forum is meaningless in itself, but it's a pointer towards broader differences in attitudes towards enforcement. Japan is a big country which multiple companies I've worked for do business with, yet I've never had to take a training course about what I, not living or working in Japan, must do to comply with Japanese data protection law. ( Should I have had to, and companies just don't bother because Japan i…

> Japan is a big country which multiple companies I've worked for do business with, yet I've never had to take a training course about what I, not living or working in Japan, must do to comply with Japanese data protection law.

Ironically another contrast with the EU; not talk but actions. Keeping things on prem, keeping it on local clouds. How many of the pure Japanese companies (not subsidiaries of foreign corps) you worked at had all their customer data on AWS/Azure/GCP? Unless you worked with a very specific subset of them, overall it's a much lower percentage than the EU. And then Korea is even a lot lower than that.

Devil's advocate might say "well Japan is just like that because of other reasons, in reality they don't care about privacy or data protection". But a lot of those reasons are still linked to a broader idea of sovereignty, which is keeping things national.

Re: US orders diplomats to fight data sovereignty initiatives

#432

Post by tick_tock_tick »

soco wrote: post #348
tick_tock_tick wrote: post #318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's 100% acceptable in real life that the whole concept of free speech. Seriously you can say shit like that all day every day in the USA and the cops probably won't even bother you.

Probably here lies the entire chasm between the US and Europe. In Europe insulting people on the street is not considered acceptable, also spreading neonazi propaganda and everything - ACLU or not (btw ACLU is also an US thing). So the US will jump at the idea of containing someone who publishes threats and insults, while the European will, well, try to contain them. I'm an European and call that respect for your co…

The issue is European will with a straight face say they have freedom of speech.

Re: US orders diplomats to fight data sovereignty initiatives

#433

Post by watwut »

beachy wrote: post #393
victorbjorklund wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rest of NATO has more soldiers than US. Would US win? Maybe. But how many millions dead Americans? US lost in Afghanistan and there they just fought terrorists.

The US (like any country) struggles in asymmetrical/guerilla warfare. It always devolves to the famous statement by a US officer during the Vietnam war that “We had to destroy Ben Tre in order to save it.” If the gloves were off then the equation would be different. A fight with the rest of NATO would be conventional warfare where the US has a giant advantage.

USA would eventually loose, because it generally looses wars in the long term.

But Europeans would suffer more while Americans would consider themselves the real victims.

Re: US orders diplomats to fight data sovereignty initiatives

#434

Post by watwut »

roysting wrote: post #349
tick_tock_tick wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No sovereign nation should use US companies for data storage or processing. Period. So what is Europe supposed to do just stop pretending to be sovereign?

I am not sure if you meant to say what you said. By many measures Europe is in fact pretending to be sovereign. I think it is what they are attempting to do at the moment, "stop pretending to be sovereign" and actually BE sovereign. At least that seems to be the claimed attempt. If anyone is not sure why I would say that Europe is not sovereign, I will answer that question if you ask, but considering the current stat…

> By many measures Europe is in fact pretending to be sovereign.

The ideology that claims no one except the biggest military is sovereign ... is fascism.

Re: US orders diplomats to fight data sovereignty initiatives

#435

Post by rcxdude »

TacticalCoder wrote: post #396
pyuser583 wrote: post #382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

European countries aren’t known for strong privacy against the state. There are exceptions, but the EU’s “privacy rights” are almost exclusively against corporations. American privacy, by contrast, is almost exclusively focused on state surveillance. There are holes, the biggest being that foreigners on foreign soil have no privacy rights. Nor do the dead. But I’m not impressed with the “rights” Europeans have agains…

[flagged]

I mean, it is very useful to keep in mind that for any question of 'can you guarantee that X government system won't be used for Y in the future' the answer is 'no', because the government is what makes the rules. That would hopefully work to prevent X being built, but I think it's better than pretending that it's possible to guarantee Y won't happen.

Re: US orders diplomats to fight data sovereignty initiatives

#437

Post by aspect0545 »

TacticalCoder wrote: post #396
pyuser583 wrote: post #382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

European countries aren’t known for strong privacy against the state. There are exceptions, but the EU’s “privacy rights” are almost exclusively against corporations. American privacy, by contrast, is almost exclusively focused on state surveillance. There are holes, the biggest being that foreigners on foreign soil have no privacy rights. Nor do the dead. But I’m not impressed with the “rights” Europeans have agains…

[flagged]

> Lately the EU Commission came up with a plan to create an inventory of every single valuable items owned by every single EU citizen: from Magic The Gathering and Pokemon cards to jewelry/heirloom, paintings, gold and silver coins/bars, cryptocurrencies coins, watches, cars, boats, etc. Anything with some value: would go in the inventory. >The European Parliament asked the question: "Can you guarantee us this will never ever be used as a basis to confiscate these items?" to which the European Commission answered: "No, we cannot guarantee that".

Excuse me for not taking this at face value but this sounds like disinformation. Where did you get that from?

Re: US orders diplomats to fight data sovereignty initiatives

#438

Post by croon »

ta9000 wrote: post #416
roger110 wrote: post #406

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the US basically sees DMA, GDPR, etc as a tariff

It’s definitely made browsing the open web a worse experience. There should be global opt in/out.

Companies made browsing the web a bad experience, not GDPR.

This sentiment is so widespread I'm starting to wonder if it's astroturfed by anti-GDPR lobbying.

Re: US orders diplomats to fight data sovereignty initiatives

#439

Post by corford »

WarmWash wrote: post #402
corford wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A huge chunk of those trillions come from European and other non-US sources. Capital controls (or triggering the EU anti-coercion legislation), a truly integrated EU capital market and a few failed USD treasury auctions could very rapidly re-direct those flows. If https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/IIPUSNETIQ starts reversing, you'll see a lot of US & EU tech re-pricing (and not in the US's favour). Europe's tech tal…

>A huge chunk of those trillions come from European and other non-US sources. Well that's even worse isn't it. Europe invents something only for the US to produce it and then sell it back to Europe? Maybe it's time for Europeans to come home from their 30 year post cold war vacation. 60-70 hour work weeks, performance based job security, 15 days vacation (that you work during anyway), corporate tax exemptions funded…

>But you probably recoiled in horror reading that.

Not really. I laughed at your cartoonish notion of Europe (and the idea that the US way is somehow the only or most desirable goal).

For a more balanced understanding of US vs EU relative performance and QoL, this is a helpful, recent analysis: https://paulkrugman.substack.com/p/europe-v-america-whos-rea...

If the EU just continues to slowly, deliberately continue on it's path towards tighter integrated capital markets, less reliance on US security, continuing energy build out and the growing of the EUR's share of global transactions; I think that will already be more than sufficient without the need for Europeans to "come home from their 30 year post cold war vacation." - whatever that means.

Re: US orders diplomats to fight data sovereignty initiatives

#440

Post by solstice »

aspect0545 wrote: post #437
TacticalCoder wrote: post #396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> Lately the EU Commission came up with a plan to create an inventory of every single valuable items owned by every single EU citizen: from Magic The Gathering and Pokemon cards to jewelry/heirloom, paintings, gold and silver coins/bars, cryptocurrencies coins, watches, cars, boats, etc. Anything with some value: would go in the inventory. >The European Parliament asked the question: "Can you guarantee us this will n…

After quickly googling, it seems that the plans do not go as far as they make them out to be. The things to be catalogued are only those relevant in the fight against money-laundering. That's hardly "full commie style inventory of every single item with any value".

Links (in German, unfortunately): - https://dpa-factchecking.com/germany/240812-99-93247/ - https://www.money-coaching.de/politik-und-meinung/eu-vermoeg... - https://creditanstalt.co.at/2025/10/08/vermoegensregister-in...

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