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The Age Verification Trap: Verifying age undermines everyone's data protection

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Re: The Age Verification Trap: Verifying age undermines everyone's data protection

#431

Post by Fervicus »

JohnMakin wrote: post #261

We'll try everything, it seems, other than holding parents accountable for what their children consume. In the United States, you can get in trouble if you recklessly leave around or provide alcohol/guns/cigarettes for a minor to start using, yet somehow, the same social responsibility seems thrown out the window for parents and the web. Yes, children are clever - I was one once. If you want to actually protect child…

> We'll try everything, it seems, other than holding parents accountable for what their children consume.

The mistake in this reasoning is assuming that they are actually interested in protecting the children.

Re: The Age Verification Trap: Verifying age undermines everyone's data protection

#432

Post by techblueberry »

JohnMakin wrote: post #261

We'll try everything, it seems, other than holding parents accountable for what their children consume. In the United States, you can get in trouble if you recklessly leave around or provide alcohol/guns/cigarettes for a minor to start using, yet somehow, the same social responsibility seems thrown out the window for parents and the web. Yes, children are clever - I was one once. If you want to actually protect child…

I know this is weird, but I'm in some ways not really sure who is on the side of freedom here. I get your position, but like. The whole idea of the promise of the internet has been destroyed by newsfeeds and mega-corps.

There is almost literally documented examples of Facebook executives twirling their mustaches wondering how they can get kids more addicted. This isn't a few bands with swear words, and in fact, I think that the damage these social media companies are doing is in fact, reducing the independence teens and kids that have that were the fears parents originally had.

I dunno, are you uncertain about your case at all or just like. I just like, can't help but start with fuck these companies. All other arguments are downstream of that. Better the nanny state than Nanny Zuck.

Re: The Age Verification Trap: Verifying age undermines everyone's data protection

#433

Post by jama211 »

ipaddr wrote: post #362
2duct wrote: post #351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A monitoring solution might have worked for my case if my parents had monitored my Internet history, if they always made sure to check in on what I thought/felt from what I watched and made sure I felt secure in relying on them to back me up in the worst cases. But I didn't have emotionally mature parents, and I'm sure so many children growing up now don't either. They're going to read arguments like these and say th…

Should the state have force your parents to give you up for adoption? That's the social support the state can offer.

So the only options are no support or give you up for adoption? No middle ground is possible?

Re: The Age Verification Trap: Verifying age undermines everyone's data protection

#434

Post by SecretDreams »

JohnMakin wrote: post #261

We'll try everything, it seems, other than holding parents accountable for what their children consume. In the United States, you can get in trouble if you recklessly leave around or provide alcohol/guns/cigarettes for a minor to start using, yet somehow, the same social responsibility seems thrown out the window for parents and the web. Yes, children are clever - I was one once. If you want to actually protect child…

ITT are a lot* of tech workers who made their money as a cog in the system poisoning the internet that future generations would have to swim in. I wonder if toxic waste companies also tell the parents it's strictly on them to keep their kids out of the lakes that are poisoned, but once flowed cleanly?

We live in a shared world with shared responsibilities. If you are working on a product, or ever did work on a product, that made the internet worse rather than better, you have a shared responsibility to right that wrong. And parents do have to protect their kids, but they can't do it alone with how systematically children are targeted today by predatory tech companies.

Re: The Age Verification Trap: Verifying age undermines everyone's data protection

#435

Post by marliechiller »

jama211 wrote: post #427
JohnMakin wrote: post #261

We'll try everything, it seems, other than holding parents accountable for what their children consume. In the United States, you can get in trouble if you recklessly leave around or provide alcohol/guns/cigarettes for a minor to start using, yet somehow, the same social responsibility seems thrown out the window for parents and the web. Yes, children are clever - I was one once. If you want to actually protect child…

Ah, the abstinence theory of protection. How it continues to rear its ugly head. Why this utter drivel is the top comment is beyond me, unbelievable.

Can you offer some rebuttal to give some credence to your point?

Re: The Age Verification Trap: Verifying age undermines everyone's data protection

#436

Post by reorder9695 »

What's always got me about this is when I was in school I had it absolutely drilled into me that I should never expose personal information online to anyone, I completely saw the logic in that and so heavily limit the personal data I give out. Now we're just expecting people to completely go against that and give away the most personal details possible to companies who cannot prove what they are or are not doing with it just because governments have decided that's best now?

Re: The Age Verification Trap: Verifying age undermines everyone's data protection

#437

Post by JohnMakin »

jama211 wrote: post #427
JohnMakin wrote: post #261

We'll try everything, it seems, other than holding parents accountable for what their children consume. In the United States, you can get in trouble if you recklessly leave around or provide alcohol/guns/cigarettes for a minor to start using, yet somehow, the same social responsibility seems thrown out the window for parents and the web. Yes, children are clever - I was one once. If you want to actually protect child…

Ah, the abstinence theory of protection. How it continues to rear its ugly head. Why this utter drivel is the top comment is beyond me, unbelievable.

That is not what the post you are replying to is advocating for at all - try reading it one more time without so much hostility

Re: The Age Verification Trap: Verifying age undermines everyone's data protection

#438

Post by pokstad »

techblueberry wrote: post #432
JohnMakin wrote: post #261

We'll try everything, it seems, other than holding parents accountable for what their children consume. In the United States, you can get in trouble if you recklessly leave around or provide alcohol/guns/cigarettes for a minor to start using, yet somehow, the same social responsibility seems thrown out the window for parents and the web. Yes, children are clever - I was one once. If you want to actually protect child…

I know this is weird, but I'm in some ways not really sure who is on the side of freedom here. I get your position, but like. The whole idea of the promise of the internet has been destroyed by newsfeeds and mega-corps. There is almost literally documented examples of Facebook executives twirling their mustaches wondering how they can get kids more addicted. This isn't a few bands with swear words, and in fact, I thi…

Social media is like tobacco. We went after tobacco for targeting kids, we should do the same to social media. Highly engineered addictive content is not unlike what was done to cigarettes.

Re: The Age Verification Trap: Verifying age undermines everyone's data protection

#440

Post by jlokier »

1shooner wrote: post #413
Salgat wrote: post #318

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This only works if I ban my child from having any friends since they all have unlimited mobile access to the internet.

Could your child not just call or text their friends? Or is the real expectation to not have to intervene at all about their preferred platform?

I think the idea is for the child see their friends in person... not call, text, or internet.

So even if their own child has no phone at all, they have access to the internet through other children's unlimited mobile access.

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