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I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

marcusolang.substack.com

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Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#431

Post by noufalibrahim »

GMoromisato wrote: post #262
phantasmish wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obsession with short sentences and generally pushing extreme simplicity of structure and word choice has been terrible for English prose. It’s not been terrible because most people aren’t aided by such guidance (most are) but because the same people who can’t be trusted to wield a quill without the bumper-lanes installed see a sentence longer than ten words, or a semicolon, or god forbid literate and appropriate nuan…

"He walked up to Helen and asked, 'What are you doing?'" "He strode up to Helen and asked, 'What are you doing?'" "He sidled up to Helen and asked, 'What are you doing?'" "He tromped up to Helen and asked, 'What are you doing?'" Each of those sentences conveys as slightly different action. You can almost imagine the person's face has a different expression in each version. Yes, I hate it when amateurs just search/rep…

Very much agree. In the rush to "simplify" writing, we've stripped out a lot of the colour in the prose and made it boring. Sentences have a certain rhythm which becomes even more apparent when they're read out loudly or performed by someone with good vocal training.

I can see the appeal in, perhaps, technical writing but even there, I feel that there's room to make the prose more colourful.

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#432

Post by somenameforme »

komali2 wrote: post #417
somenameforme wrote: post #414

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The internet has been even worse. We tend to speak literally and simply. And I don't really know why that is. Perhaps it's because if there's something beyond the overt, it might go completely missed. For instance Mark Twain is basically full of endless amazing quotes with lovely nuance, yet in contemporary times how many people would miss the meaning in a statement like "Prosperity is the best protector of principle…

"Prosperity is the best protector of principle" taken out of context can be used in many ways, including by a rich person arguing that rich people have better morals, and poor people have worse ones, and that's why they're poor. The context is really necessary.

Whether one is trying to use it literally or ironically, it means the exact same thing. The only question is whether the speaker and the reader understand what it means. And in fact in this case there was no context at all in Twain's original usage - it was the epigraph for a chapter in this work. [1]

And that's what I mean in that modern writing, on the internet - though rapidly leaking into 'real life', has become highly infantilized where we assume everybody reading is an idiot, and speak accordingly which, in turn, infantilizes and 'idiotizes' our own speech, and simply makes it far more bland and less expressive.

Interestingly, this is not ubiquitous. In other cultures, including on the internet, there remains much more use of irony, and more general nuance in speech. I suspect a big part of the death of English fluency was driven by political correctness - zomg what if somebody interprets what I'm saying the wrong way!?!

[1] - https://www.gutenberg.org/files/2895/2895-h/2895-h.htm

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#433

Post by GMoromisato »

hsn915 wrote: post #408
GMoromisato wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"He walked up to Helen and asked, 'What are you doing?'" "He strode up to Helen and asked, 'What are you doing?'" "He sidled up to Helen and asked, 'What are you doing?'" "He tromped up to Helen and asked, 'What are you doing?'" Each of those sentences conveys as slightly different action. You can almost imagine the person's face has a different expression in each version. Yes, I hate it when amateurs just search/rep…

Non-native English speaker here. I would not understand the last two sentences. Sidle? Tromp? I don't think I've seen these words enough times for them to register in my mind. "Strode", I would probably understand after a few seconds of squeezing my brain. I mean, I sort of know "stride", but not as an action someone would take. Rather as the number of bytes a row of pixels takes in a pixel buffer. I would have to ex…

English is hard, even for native speakers. But it's also wonderful! English loves to steal words from other languages, and good writers love to choose the right word. It's like having an expansive wardrobe and picking just the right outfit for every event.

Bad writers, of course, pick a word to make them seem smarter (which, of course, often fails). That's what the OP was complaining about: using a fancy word just to impress.

But "stride" is not just a fancy version of "walk". When a person strides they are taking big steps; their head is held high, and they are confident in who they are and where they're going.

"Sidle" is the opposite. A person who sidles is timid and meek; they walk slowly, or maybe sideways, hoping that no one will notice them.

And "tromp," of course, sounds like something heavy and dour. A person who tromps stamps their feet with every step; you hear them coming. They are angry or maybe clumsy and graceless.

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#434

Post by OhioMan2943 »

wccrawford wrote: post #2

It's the curse of writing well. ChatGPT is designed to write well, and so everyone who does that is accused of being AI. I just saw someone today that multiple people accused of using ChatGPT, but their post was one solid block of text and had multiple grammar errors. But they used something similar to the way ChatGPT speaks, so they got accused of it and the accusers got massive upvotes.

It writes well by the impression of the average person...

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#435

Post by OhioMan2943 »

rdtsc wrote: post #276

> I don't write like ChatGPT. ChatGPT, in its strange, disembodied, globally-sourced way, writes like me. We will all soon write and talk like ChatGPT. Kids growing up asking ChatGPT for homework help, people use it for therapy, to resumes, for CVs, for their imaginary romantic "friends", asking every day questions from the search engine they'll get some LLM response. After some time you'll find yourself chatting wit…

Yep will kill myself if it gets to this stage

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#436

Post by ThePowerOfFuet »

mmooss wrote: post #365
AnonymousPlanet wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> [...] I'm a native English speaker that studied writing in university [...] As a native English speaker who studied writing at university, do you think "who" should be used with people while "that" should only be used with things or the other way round. Or should I just not care? Edit: missing things

I think you might intend to compare 'that' and 'which'? Common advice is to use 'that' with people and 'which' with objects, though that isn't necessarily followed and omits many nuances. Use 'who' with people especially, often with other living beings ('my dog, who runs away daily, always is home for dinner') or groups of them ('the NY Yankees, who won the championship that year, were my favorite'), but never with o…

>Common advice is to use 'that' with people and 'which' with objects, though that isn't necessarily followed

Well played.

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#437

Post by fragmede »

mmooss wrote: post #365
AnonymousPlanet wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> [...] I'm a native English speaker that studied writing in university [...] As a native English speaker who studied writing at university, do you think "who" should be used with people while "that" should only be used with things or the other way round. Or should I just not care? Edit: missing things

I think you might intend to compare 'that' and 'which'? Common advice is to use 'that' with people and 'which' with objects, though that isn't necessarily followed and omits many nuances. Use 'who' with people especially, often with other living beings ('my dog, who runs away daily, always is home for dinner') or groups of them ('the NY Yankees, who won the championship that year, were my favorite'), but never with o…

Whom among us has not misused whom.

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#438

Post by whstl »

rippeltippel wrote: post #430
encroach wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you prefer a simpler style, then why did you write "the deeper I got into the world of literature" instead of "as I studied literature more"? Why did you say you were "pushed towards" simpler language instead of "I liked it more"? Why did you say "I feel the pain in my bones" and "drives me insane" instead of "I dislike it"? Why did you say "the big boy SAT words should pop out of the page unaccompanied" instead o…

> Perhaps flowery language expands your ability to express yourself? What you call "flowery" is actually "expressive". Different words, although related, convey subtle differences in meaning. That's what literature (especially poetry) is about. I would add that our words define our world: a richer vocabulary leads to more articulated experiences. So, writing "flowery" sentences can actually denote someone capable of…

It's both of those, and more.

It's "flowery" when you dislike it and "expressive" when you like it.

It’s “overcomplicated” when you don’t get it and “nuanced” when you do.

It’s “pretentious” when it annoys you and “ambitious” when it excites you.

It’s “loud” when you hate it and “energetic” when you love it.

Just like TFA, different people write differently and different people have different opinions.

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#439

Post by frm88 »

glitchc wrote: post #351
phantasmish wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"He scrambled up to Helen and asked, 'What are you doing?'" "He kick-flipped up to Helen and asked, 'What are you doing?'" [edit] electric-slid! Pirouetted! Somersaulted!

Let's not forget "sashayed" and "marched"

I love sashayed. It's always accompanied with a mental image of a person clad in some silk, floor length robe who walks a slightly sidewards, the fabric whispering. I have no idea where that image came from, but it's always there.

Re: I'm Kenyan. I don't write like ChatGPT, ChatGPT writes like me

#440

Post by whstl »

meatmanek wrote: post #380
munificent wrote: post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article itself does an excellent job spelling out the background: > This style has a history, of course, a history far older than the microchip: It is a direct linguistic descendant of the British Empire. The English we were taught was not the fluid, evolving language of modern-day London or California, filled with slang and convenient abbreviations. It was the Queen's English, the language of the colonial admini…

Sometimes it's about matching the fashion of the group you aspire to be part of, sometimes it's about having that fashion imposed on you so you look "professional". Security guards at tech company offices are the only ones who wear suits, presumably because it's a mandated uniform, not by choice.

Apocryphal, but someone once told me history of male grooming is an example of this: When only rich people could afford to shave, the fashion among the noble was to have a clean-shaved face to signal status, and poor people had beards. Once safety razors appeared, then the trend reverted.
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