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Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

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Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#431

Post by sandspar »

mattjreid wrote: post #229
red_hare wrote: post #219

Can you imagine explaining to someone from the 1800s that we've created a fully generative virtual world experience and the demo was "painting a wall blue"

They would be impressed by the paint roller - it wasn't invented until the 1940s.

There's an old documentary where a film crew transported some of those "uncontacted tribe" guys to central London. Rather than being in awe of jet engines or networked internet, the tribesmen guys spent most of their time admiring house construction. "You're telling me there's METAL inside these walls?" I guess we tend to appreciate what we can understand.

Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#432

Post by abrookewood »

wolttam wrote: post #388
maerF0x0 wrote: post #376

I'm still struggling to imagine a world where predicting the next pixel wins over over building a deterministic thing that is then ran. Eg: Using AI to generate textures, wire models, motion sequences which themselves sum up to something that local graphics card can then render into a scene. I'm very much not an expert in this space, but to me it seems if you do that, then you can tweak the wire model, the texture, m…

At some point it will be computationally cheaper to predict the next pixel than to classically render the scene, when talking about scenes beyond a certain graphical fidelity. The model can infinitely zoom in to some surface and depict(/predict) what would really be there. Trying to do so via classical rendering introduces many technical challenges

Can you explain why this is the case? I don't understand why.

Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#433

Post by kkukshtel »

ewoodrich wrote: post #322
kkukshtel wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I similarly am surprised at how fast they are progressing. I wrote this piece a few months ago about how I think steering world model output is the next realm of AAA gaming: https://kylekukshtel.com/diffusion-aaa-gamedev-doom-minecraf... But even when I wrote that I thought things were still a few years out. I facetiously said that Rockstar would be nerd-sniped on GTA6 by a world model, which sounded crazy a few mont…

> Rockstar would be nerd-sniped on GTA6 by a world model I'm having trouble parsing your meaning here. GTA isn't really a "drive on the street simulator", is it? There is deliberate creative and artistic vision that makes the series so enjoyable to play even decades after release, despite the graphics quality becoming more dated every year by AAA standards. Are you saying someone would "vibe model" a GTAish clone wit…

I don't _really_ mean it obviously but I think a key component of what makes something like GTA compelling is that fully modeled world you move around in. These things take what amounts to hundreds if not thousands of man years to create "traditionally", and the fact someone can now prompt to life a city or any other environment with simiailr (or better) fidelity is a massive change in how we think about creative content production.

GTA6 will not actually be nerd-sniped, but it's easy to see how a lot of what makes the game defensible is being rapidly commoditized.

Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#435

Post by kkukshtel »

corimaith wrote: post #405
kkukshtel wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I similarly am surprised at how fast they are progressing. I wrote this piece a few months ago about how I think steering world model output is the next realm of AAA gaming: https://kylekukshtel.com/diffusion-aaa-gamedev-doom-minecraf... But even when I wrote that I thought things were still a few years out. I facetiously said that Rockstar would be nerd-sniped on GTA6 by a world model, which sounded crazy a few mont…

The future of games was MMORPGs and RPG-ization in general as other genres adopted progression systems. But the former two are simply too expensive and risky even today for AAA to develop. Which brings us to another point, the problem with Western AAA is more about high levels of risk aversion, which is what's really feeding the lack of imaginative. And that's more to do with the economics of opportunity cost to the…

You may be interested in reading something I wrote a while ago that's pretty dead on to what you're talking about there:

https://kylekukshtel.com/game-design-mimetics

Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#436

Post by slaterbug »

j_timberlake wrote: post #354
timeattack wrote: post #75

Advances in generative AI are making me progressively more and more depressive. Creativity is taken from us at exponential rate. And I don't buy argument from people who are saying they are excited to live in this age. I can get that if that technology stopped at current state and remained to be just tools for our creative endeavours, but it doesn't seem to be an endgame here. Instead it aims to be a complete replace…

I don't know how on Earth people can think like this. Most people can find "value" in a slice of pizza. It doesn't even have to be a good pizza. Or kittens and puppies. Do you think there won't be kittens and puppies? And that's putting aside all the obvious space-exploration stuff that will probably be more interesting than anything the previous 100 billion humans ever saw.

This is digressing a bit, but I don't buy that space exploration will be more interesting than anything you can see on Earth.

Aren't other planets / moons etc. basically just barren deserts of rock and dust? Once you get over the novelty of it, it will basically just be the shittiest and most uncomfortable place you've ever been.

Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#437

Post by slaterbug »

rohit89 wrote: post #257
timeattack wrote: post #75

Advances in generative AI are making me progressively more and more depressive. Creativity is taken from us at exponential rate. And I don't buy argument from people who are saying they are excited to live in this age. I can get that if that technology stopped at current state and remained to be just tools for our creative endeavours, but it doesn't seem to be an endgame here. Instead it aims to be a complete replace…

> So what is final state here for us? I think we have a long way to go yet. Humanity is still in the early stages of its tech tree with so many unknown and unsolved problems. If ASI does happen and solves literally everything, we will be in a position that is completely alien to what we have right now. > How to even find the value in living given all of that? I feel like a lot of AI angst comes from people who place…

> I feel like a lot of AI angst comes from people who place their self-worth and value on external validation. There is value in simply existing and doing what you want to do even if nobody else wants it.

I agree on this point, and have come to that conclusion myself regarding my own AI angst. However that doesn't solve the economic issues that arise from this technology. As large swathes of the workforce becomes replaced (something that, in my opinion, is rapidly approaching), how do we organise society so that everyone can survive / thrive?

As far as I can see there is very little impetus behind tackling such issues, compared to the forces pushing this tech forward so rapidly.

Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#438

Post by slaterbug »

curious_cat_163 wrote: post #226
timeattack wrote: post #75

Advances in generative AI are making me progressively more and more depressive. Creativity is taken from us at exponential rate. And I don't buy argument from people who are saying they are excited to live in this age. I can get that if that technology stopped at current state and remained to be just tools for our creative endeavours, but it doesn't seem to be an endgame here. Instead it aims to be a complete replace…

> So what is final state here for us? Return to menial not-yet-automated work? And when this would be eventually automated, what's left? Plug our brains to personalized autogenerated worlds that are tailored to trigger related neuronal circuitry for producing ever increasing dopamine levels and finally burn our brains out (which is arguably already happening with tiktok-style leasure)? And how you are supposed to pay…

> Whenever we have had a paradigm shift in our ability to process information, we have grappled with it by shifting to higher-level tasks.

People say this all the time, but I think it's a very short-sighted view. It really begs the question: do you believe that there are tasks that exist which a human can do, but we could not train an AI to also do? The difference between AI and any other technological advancement is that AI is (or promises to be, and I have no reason to believe otherwise) a tool that can be adapted to any task. I don't think analogies to history really apply here.

Re: Genie 3: A new frontier for world models

#440

Post by eboynyc32 »

modeless wrote: post #13

Consistency over multiple minutes and it runs in real time at 720p? I did not expect world models to be this good yet. > Genie 3’s consistency is an emergent capability So this just happened from scaling the model, rather than being a consequence of deliberate architecture changes? Edit: here is some commentary on limitations from someone who tried it: https://x.com/tejasdkulkarni/status/1952737669894574264 > - Physi…

Wow. How do we know if we’re not in Genie 4 right now.
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