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Ingesting PDFs and why Gemini 2.0 changes everything

sergey.fyi

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Re: Ingesting PDFs and why Gemini 2.0 changes everything

#431

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Software is dead, if it isn't a prompt now, it will be a prompt in 6 months. Most of what we think software is today, will just be a UI. But UIs are also dead.

Software without data moats, vender lock-in, etc sure will. All the low handing fruit saas is going to get totally obliterated by LLM built-software.

The only thing that will be different for most is vendor lock-in will be to LLM vendors.

Re: Ingesting PDFs and why Gemini 2.0 changes everything

#432

This is using exactly the wrong tools at every stage of the OCR pipeline, and the cost is astronomical as a result. You don't use multimodal models to extract a wall of text from an image. They hallucinate constantly the second you get past perfect 100% high-fidelity images. You use an object detection model trained on documents to find the bounding boxes of each document section as _images_; each bounding box comes…

I honestly can't tell if you are being serious. Is there any doubt that the "OCR pipeline" will just be an LLM and it's just a matter of time?

What you are describing is similar to how computer used to detect cats. You first extract edges, texture and gradient. Then use a sliding window and run a classifier. Then you use NMS to merge the bounding boxes.

Re: Ingesting PDFs and why Gemini 2.0 changes everything

#433
post #427

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It isn't a silver bullet in that it can just "make software" but it is changing the entire dynamic. You can't do point sampling to figure out where things are going. We have to look at the slope. People see a paper come out, look at the results and say, "this fails for x, y and z. doesn't work", that is now how scientific research works. This is why two minute papers has the tag line, "hold on to your papers ... two…

That's not why more experienced people are doubting you. They're doubting you because the non-digital portions of processes change at people/org speed. Which is to say that changing a core business process is a year political consensus, rearchitecture, and change management effort, because you also have to coordinate all the cascading and interfacing changes.

> changing a core business process is a year political consensus, rearchitecture, and change management effort

You are thinking within the existing structures, those structures will evaporate. All along the software supply chain, processes will get upended, not just because of how technical assets will be created, but also how organizations themselves are structured and react and in turn how software is created and consumed.

This is as big as the invention of the corporation, the printing press and the industrial revolution.

I am not here to tutor people on this viewpoint or defend it, I offer it and everyone can do with it what they will.

Re: Ingesting PDFs and why Gemini 2.0 changes everything

#434
post #427

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not why more experienced people are doubting you. They're doubting you because the non-digital portions of processes change at people/org speed. Which is to say that changing a core business process is a year political consensus, rearchitecture, and change management effort, because you also have to coordinate all the cascading and interfacing changes.

> changing a core business process is a year political consensus, rearchitecture, and change management effort You are thinking within the existing structures, those structures will evaporate. All along the software supply chain, processes will get upended, not just because of how technical assets will be created, but also how organizations themselves are structured and react and in turn how software is created and c…

Ha. Look back on this comment in a few years.

Re: Ingesting PDFs and why Gemini 2.0 changes everything

#436

I work in fintech and we replaced an OCR vendor with Gemini at work for ingesting some PDFs. After trial and error with different models Gemini won because it was so darn easy to use and it worked with minimal effort. I think one shouldn't underestimate that multi-modal, large context window model in terms of ease-of-use. Ironically this vendor is the best known and most successful vendor for OCR'ing this specific ty…

How about the comparison with traditional proprietary on premise software like ONMIPage or ABBYY or those listed below: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_optical_characte...

Re: Ingesting PDFs and why Gemini 2.0 changes everything

#438
I've built a simple OCR tool with gemini 2 flash with several options: 1-Simple OCR: Extracts all detected text from uploaded files 2-Advanced OCR: Enables rule-based extraction (e.g., table data) 3-Bulk OCR: Designed for processing multiple files at once The project will be open-source next week. You can try the tool here: https://gemini2flashocr.netlify.app

Re: Ingesting PDFs and why Gemini 2.0 changes everything

#439

I work in fintech and we replaced an OCR vendor with Gemini at work for ingesting some PDFs. After trial and error with different models Gemini won because it was so darn easy to use and it worked with minimal effort. I think one shouldn't underestimate that multi-modal, large context window model in terms of ease-of-use. Ironically this vendor is the best known and most successful vendor for OCR'ing this specific ty…

This is spot on, any legacy vendor focusing on a specific type of PDF is going to get obliterated by LLMs. The problem with using an off-the-shelf provider like this is, you get stuck with their data schema. With an LLM, you have full control over the schema meaning you can parse and extract much more unique data. The problem then shifts from "can we extract this data from the PDF" to "how do we teach an LLM to extra…

`How did you add bounding boxes, especially if it is variety of files?

Re: Ingesting PDFs and why Gemini 2.0 changes everything

#440

I work in fintech and we replaced an OCR vendor with Gemini at work for ingesting some PDFs. After trial and error with different models Gemini won because it was so darn easy to use and it worked with minimal effort. I think one shouldn't underestimate that multi-modal, large context window model in terms of ease-of-use. Ironically this vendor is the best known and most successful vendor for OCR'ing this specific ty…

This is spot on, any legacy vendor focusing on a specific type of PDF is going to get obliterated by LLMs. The problem with using an off-the-shelf provider like this is, you get stuck with their data schema. With an LLM, you have full control over the schema meaning you can parse and extract much more unique data. The problem then shifts from "can we extract this data from the PDF" to "how do we teach an LLM to extra…

Great, I landed on the reasoning and citations bit through trial and error and the outputs improved for sure.
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